TubularBelle

I'm glad your wiggly is playing Steve!

Well they should be okay if they keep their noses clean, at least thats the way it should be, but like I said in my earlier post, every man of that age in Australia who commits a crime against a child will be scrutinised to find out if he is one of them, but who cares if that happens. If they commit another such crime they should be locked away for life. You only get one chance to redeem yourself.

No worries, HB will post his picture tonight, it is 4:30pm here atm.

What about the innocent new born Muslim baby boy that has no idea and no control over the indoctrination that he is going to be subjected to and the future he has to look forward to, being blown to bits as a suicide bomber for the good of his country and being hated by every other race.

Dont know if you heard over there about a brutal murder in Melbourne just a few weeks ago. A little girl of about 8 who was in a Shopping Center with her Uncle and brother went to the Public Toilet. Her relatives stood outside a community door that led down the hall to the ladies, mens and disabled toilet. After 10 minutes they went to look for her, as she had obviously not left the area. They found her brutally beaten, limbs broken, sexually molested and dead on the floor of the disabled toilet. They gave a description of a man who had exited the area while they were waiting and within an hour or so they had arrested a 22 year old man who worked in the complex. As obviously news of the impending release, identity change and relocation to Australia of the two boys who killed James Bolger had got out, he was immediately suspected of being one of the two boys. I can't imagine how James Bolgers parents feel about their release, and we would all like to believe that the parents of the two boys involved were careless, unloving or irresponsible people. There are only two scenarios here, either that is the truth and therefore the parents are guilty of this crime, not the children, and why weren't they punished, or the parents are normal loving parents like any of us would hope to be considered and therefore any one of our children could possess the ability to do what these boys did. Would you feel the same if one of your children was the perpetrator? I always said that if one of my adult sons ever commited a heinous crime I would want them to receive the maximum punishment that they deserved, but if my 10 year old son had done such a thing, I would have to question every moment of his young life and try to understand what caused it and who was to blame. I think when young malleable children are involved, there is no black and white. For example, only one of these children would have come up with the idea to walk away with this little boy. They couldn't have both had the same evil intentions on the same day, one was an influence on the other or they gave each other the urge to keep going. This is the loss of three lives in my opinion, a tragedy.

I recently brought home a 5 month old Border Collie, I love new puppies but chose the older one for two reasons, it was 1/6th the price and I was hoping it might already be toilet trained. Turned out it was an outside dog and not trained. I looked up basic training on the net and read someone ask if Border Collies were easy to train because they are so smart but the answer was no because they can interpret the slightest change in tone in voice or hand movement as being a completely different command and they get confused. They also have an inbuilt desire to round things up, as other breeds have inbuilt characteristics, and if for example they see a small child running away, their instinct to bring it back might over rule any amount of skill you have taught it. I saw an interesting debate on tv once about whether dogs had any thought process at all other than I'm hungry, I'm sleepy and I need to pee etc. You know, emotional thought like, 'you guys are fighting because I ripped up the cushion yesterday' and the general concensus was no they don't. If this is true then the faces they pull are not reflecting any particular thought pattern but just a reflex action that they are completely unaware of. People may jest but most don't like to admit that the creature that they often expel as much time and energy into as they do their own families, is just one big ball of stupidness, but it does seem to be the case. Everything they do is instinctual. We have had Molly for 3 weeks now and she has learnt so much and we are very proud of her but there are other things she does that tell us that because we cannot explain to her that there is no way she will ever be able to pick up two balls in her mouth at the same time, that she will keep trying to do it until the day she dies. In one day she learnt to shake hands and fetch the ball, in a week she learnt that it is okay to chew on her toys, but not on our shoes and socks, in 10 seconds she learnt that if she gets too close to the cats she will lose an eye, and in 3 weeks she is finally toilet trained, and considering they don't speak or understand English, that is incredibly clever. I think skills like 'rounding up' things are definitely genetically passed on just like them not getting up and walking around on two feet is.

Just wondering, I know it isn't an obligation but has anybody ordered anything from Printbiz? Patrick might be feeling a little disheartened. We were advised on another fishing site to try those compressed air things but I certainly see your point about moisture getting in.

I voted for you.

HB wants to be in the next one so he will be posting the next photo, okay Steve? So the list is: TB John Jan Cameraman Steve Wirral Wiggles HB Cory, are you in? Anyone else?

Can't quote from two posts so firstly, referring to the above post Jaybee I think Peter was alluding to Dens comment re his photo rather than anything you said. And what I said above was referring to the fact that I personally would not choose a subject choice such as 'Wildlife and Nature' or 'Flora and Fauna' because if I was the Judge I would only want to judge one category or the other. If I was to judge flowers, I would only want to judge flowers, because I find them less interesting and less work to photograph, as a very general rule, so would possibly not choose a flower photo over a photo of a living moving creature. Your Transport example was completely different because they were all forms of transport, not transport and something else. It would be like choosing a subject like 'Transport and Shoes'. Anyone who entered a flower in MY Comp would not have to worry because if I chose 'Flowers' as a subject matter, I would only be judging flowers. I just meant that flowers and animals are two different to be judged in the same comp, that is just my personal opinion, thats all. I was really referring to 'still lifes' as opposed to 'things that move', and please don't tell me that flowers are living moving things, I know that. Obviously many many other people think 'Wildlife and Nature' and 'Flora and Fauna' go perfectly well together, but if it was me, the nature and flora probably wouldn't get a fighting chance. I was only trying to say the same thing that Den said in his post, I apologise if I did not articulate it correctly. I am certainly not saying that I have never been gobsmacked by an awesome photo of a flower, I voted for Dogfish' Holyhock in the patterns and textures Comp. My whole point of my post re following certain guidelines and criteria is that it changes with every competition because the Judge changes and as there is only one Judge and they choose the subject matter, then their own personal guidelines and criteria is all that should matter. Because the Judge changes with every competition, that means the quidelines and criteria changes with every competition and therefore, imho, allieviates the problems that you speak of. If one photographer misses out in one comp because that judge wasn't a fan of his or her style, then they will get another opportunity in the next comp with a different Judge. This also alleviates the whole issue of favouritism, esp when you have a relatively small group of contributors like we do here. Be careful not to get too sensitive here because as yet, not I or anyone has degraded your opinion.

Well that was an interesting one and the picture certainly did change a hell of a lot, but personally I think it's very irresponsible of you Wirral to put a Pub right across the road from all those children, (just a joke). Seriously though, I think people need to be a little more considerate of the other contributors and not allow your edit to undermine or change someone elses edit, which also occured in the last game. For ex, love the Pub as far as the look of the photo goes, but it should have been let go as Jan had already labelled that building a 'home'. Johns post re the Indian family and the elephant was very funny, and even though he did misunderstand Jans comment re 'after I did my stuff', it was a little rude of her to mention not once but twice that he had foiled her fountain idea. It's fine to say what you would have done if something else had not been done, but do it without making the earlier poster feel as though they have trodden on your toes. I think Jan realised and accepted this by taking Johns comments with grace. On the other hand, the dumpster was quite large and left very little space for others to add their edits. We should all make a conscious effort to compliment rather than undermine anyones previous edit and also not to 'take over' the whole photo. After all, we will all eventually get a chance to go first as the people at the top of the list obviously have more freedom and opportunity. Having said all that. I still had fun and look forward to the next one.

That was the one comment that didn't sit quite right with me either, while I was lamenting the difference between taking a technically perfect shot of a flower or a blurry shot of a dog flying through the air, I thought Dens two examples were as warranted as each other, because even if a squirrel is sitting perfectly still and practically posing for the camera, it is still an opportunistic shot which you can't just choose to take at any time of the day or night, and therefore just as valid as that of the Hawk striking it's prey. And you would NEVER discredit a photo for being technically perfect no matter how staged (as in photographing a still object) but the technicality of taking a photo of a moving object should be less important and more flexible. And while I tried very hard to not be objectionable in my last post, I've thought about this a little more and have to say one more thing. This is NOT a Photography site, it is a Fishing site and there are a myriad of Photography sites for people who want to get more precise about their Photography. Michael (HB) and I just LOVE these Comps because there is enough quality and enthusiasm and structure to them to keep them interesting and ever improving without the pressure of feeling you have to produce perfect photos every time. So while I think there may have been a slight error of judgement with regards to certain photos not being chosen for the final in the previous comp, I think adding the conditions/requirements that you mention would be detrimental to this Competition.

Firstly I would like to congratulate Jaybee on having the gumption to speak his mind. I'm not saying this will happen here, but once in a work situation I spoke up on behalf of the team only to not get the back up I expected leaving me as the sole voice and that is a big risk you take in this type of situation. I imagine this was extrememly difficult for you to do because no-one feels comfortable blowing their own trumpet but in this case I expect you received many pms from people stating that your Kingfisher or one or two other entries should have gotten into the final three. Every competition we all have slightly different opinions on who should have gotten into the finals but they are generally fairly agreeable. I think that was has happened this time is not so much that there was anything wrong with the ones that did get in, but moreso that there was at least one very obvious and unanimous worthy entry that didn't get in. Unfortunately from an extremely amateur photographer point of view, while I was as upset as many it seems that certain entries did not get into the finals, I do think that as the Judge is NOT a professional and as it his/her PRIZE or REWARD for winning the previous comp, that they be allowed to choose the SUBJECT and the FINALISTS, that they should be allowed to do this without questioning. For example, I am not a flower lover, if a comp was entirely about flowers I would have no problems picking a winner but when they are competing against animals for ex in comps such as 'Wildlife and Nature' or 'Flora and Fauna', there would be no chance of a flower getting into the final three if I was the Judge for two reasons. I think animals and insects are more interesting and ulitmately more difficult to photograph, and I think that is the real issue here, anyone can point a camera at a flower and go snap, while moving objects are infinitely more difficult to photograph and these two subjects, from a purely photographic requirement aspect, possibly should not be grouped together. However, the person who chose this subject obviously finds Nature AS interesting as Wildlife or she would not have chosen it. I would never have known that Judys pic was not Wildlife but surely it still fits under the criteria of Nature and I'd be interested in why you think it does not fit, just for my own curiousity. My perception of your reason here is that a rose would have been as unacceptable an entry as a dog or a cat, is that right? HBs entry by the way was a Native Australian Wattle bush found in the National Park. I do agree with half of what you say but I think it is unfair to expect the Judges to judge purely on photgraphic merit. We are not professionals, we don't all know what to look for, and we are entitled to pick what we like. The participants are protected in a couple of ways, firstly, we all get to vote on the final 3, and secondly the Judge changes every time, so if you don't like a certain Judges choices you only have to accept them once. Also, if the person who chose the subject is the same person who chooses the finalists, then that guarantees that what is chosen fits THEIR criteria. I don't expect anyone to be able to remember the Dog Comp as it was so long ago, but I chose that subject for fun and because I like dogs, the subject matter could hardly have been considered a good choice from a compositional skill point of view. Also I chose a photo, after much agonising about it I must admit for this very reason, that was plain awful from a technical view, it was as blurry as **** and only got one or two votes because of this. I knew it wouldn't win but I wanted it in the final three because it epitomised what I had in mind for my comp choice, a dog 'flying through the air'. One last comment with regard to just the whole general 'having your say' thing. I say what I think to the point of annoying moderators and members on ALL the sites that I am a member of. And when you do speak your mind, it is unavoidable that someone will not agree. I personally get very upset when people who give thought out opinions often get strong responses while others who make very unnecessary snippy or 'cheap jab' type comments are left to their own devices. Thanks for your thoughtfull comments Jaybee. P.S.-Wow, I was posting at the same time as Den and we pretty much are saying the same thing. Oh and yeh Wiggles, if you have something to say, nows the time my dear, let it all out, don't be shy.

I think the second one certainly could be set up but the first one looks pretty genuine, grannies are so entertaining don't you think.

Yeh the nest looks very strong and sturdy, I was just looking at the part that is attached to the tree. Not first timers then, are they the same adults coming back each year or do you think the babies take over the nest and have their own babies.

Does Cory even know it is his turn because he was added into the middle of the list and may have expected to go on the end.

DSYLEXICS OF THE WORLD UNTIE!!! What do you get when you cross a insomniac, an agnostic and a dsylexic? Someone who lays awake at night wondering if there really is a dog.

I am only assuming, I admit that. But what I believed of that society is that the covering up is to show humility, they would not be wearing modern shoes, or modern handbags or having their photos taken in that manner, maybe in the background at the kitchen sink while the husband is being photographed. I think the photo is fake. And the title, 'Worlds most pointless photo', did that come with the email you received? Because it is, and that is why it is funny.

My point that I was making was that Howard is only interested in being Bush's bum buddy regardless of the political issue, and that my comments were not relating to the Muslim issue.

And this one. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BPZH-etkLqk

While looking at Frantics Damsel Fly video (very nice by the way) I found this, it is so funny. Watch and listen closely now.

Onya John, that's very funny.

Unbloodybelievable, I had no idea!

Yeh Im sure it was always intended as a joke. Those people don't take photos of themselves, the whole cover up thing has to do with humility, or am I being a real numpty?

There are filters on Limewire that stop porn from getting through, plus it is easy to see if it is porn, they are usually only 1,500kbs and if you hold the cursor over it it says Adults Only. But use the filter.