Trouble brewing?

[Rusty]

Also another "maybe",has the guy actually caught people nicking fish or is this just another case of jumping on the band wagon? Might explain why the Police have never been contacted and yet another case of some one just giving the customers what they (or he thinks ) they want?

 

I don't know Budgie, my comments are based on the assumption that he has. If he hasn't caught anyone then it's a completely different discussion and I wouldn't have given it the time of day.

 

My comments are also based on living in the real world (which I think you appreciate but don't necessarily like) and if anyone thinks this is a simple case of 'let the authorities deal with it' then they are optimistic shall we say.

 

I think it's unfortunate that the racism issue has been brought into this when we are simply looking at a situation where a group of people have been caught stealing fish, but that’s the media for you I guess. For the owner to take that sort of action it's reasonable to assume that there are not loads more Polish anglers fishing his water without taking fish (if there were he’d be losing revenue).

 

I agree with your points Budgie and I still support this guy if fish are being taken by (from his point of view) a majority group.

[Dick Dastardly]

My comments are also based on living in the real world (which I think you appreciate but don't necessarily like)

 

Yup I think youve got me their mate!

 

I dont like the way the "racism" card is played in a lot of circumstances and dont really think its the correct way to describe whats going on here.Its difficult for me to explain my actual thoughts as my vocabulary and skills with the written word are poor at best.

 

I will try.Its not because the people he banned/is banning are Polish (now in my understanding and/or use of the term that would be "racist") that I object. I think cries of "racism" just muddy the waters.Its just that he has descriminated against a group/type of people because of the actions of a few/some of the members of that group.

 

The entry of "the Nazis" into the disscusion was possibly my fault as my reference to many British soldiers fighting for the basic rights of "freedom/equality,fairness(?)" was more what I meant when in general the British public seems to have become so biggoted! That was my point rather than likening the guy to the Nazi atrocities regarding racism/genocide (allthough their seeming aim to control and force their opinions on others is a perfectly acceptable example)

 

But like I said I cant argue with you because like you said sadly it is the real world these days.

 

People complain about the "stereotyping" of certain groups but of course stereotypes only come about because they are in general true! The PC crowd hate it but its true.But if we have to give every black youth the benifit of the doubt that he isnt dealing drugs and carrying a knife,every Gypsy the benifit that hes not going to steal,con or leave a mountain of rubbish,every drunk that wants to come into a pub that hes not going to fight,throw up,make a nuiscense of him self, not every one with shorthair and of a big build is a ruffian etc etc etc. Then we should surely extend that to all descrimination? Like I say all "groups" have bad apples.And personal experience with one of those is enough (or seems to be) to damn them all!

 

I know what the answer is and I bet many of you do as well! but Rusty your right I am living in the real world but simply dont like it! Very frustrating.

Edited August 16, 2009 by BUDGIE

[Alan Stubbs]

I recently got rather heavy handed with a guy who poss regularly on the non-fishing forum. He advicates banning immigration to the UK of EU-Citizens, withdrawal from the EU and a return to US style isolationism on the belief that the Commonwealth of Nations would instantly make up for any shortfall in trade and tariff impositions on the UK by the EU.

 

I maintain his idea is not only wrong, but to read his posts, I suspect they're racially motivated.

 

The fishery owner ignoring the law of the land, imposing his own rules as a blanket policy on his fishery is illegal, short-sighted and I suspect would find its customers limited to BNP anglers. To make such a imposition without prior recourse to the law makes me wonder if he extends that stupidity to his husbandry of the fishery?

 

Why is it only the Polish and Eastern Europeans he has targetted..... come to any large town and see how bad the British can be i terms of theft and vandalism.

[Rusty]

Why is it only the Polish and Eastern Europeans he has targetted.....

 

Because

 

"He claims he has caught some Polish anglers catching fish, bagging them up and dangling them under the water.

 

He said: "I put it up because the Polish people are stealing my fish, I have been catching them all the time."

[gozzer]

Because

 

"He claims he has caught some Polish anglers catching fish, bagging them up and dangling them under the water.

 

He said: "I put it up because the Polish people are stealing my fish, I have been catching them all the time."

 

There's a difference between the two sentences you quoted Rusty.

 

He caught "some Polish anglers", but he put the notice up because "the Polish people are stealing my fish".

The second one infers that all Polish people steal fish, because he caught some Poles doing it. Poor logic to say the least.

 

I read on another forum that apparently the police had been involved at one time. Apparently he had confronted the thieves and they took no notice, so he came back with a rottie and a shot gun, hence the police involvement.

 

There are many ways he could have avoided this situation and still had control of who fished his water.

 

The wording of the two sentences you quoted,(I feel) are a big clue as to how his mind works.

 

John.

[Alan Stubbs]

There's a difference between the two sentences you quoted Rusty.

 

He caught "some Polish anglers", but he put the notice up because "the Polish people are stealing my fish".

The second one infers that all Polish people steal fish, because he caught some Poles doing it. Poor logic to say the least.

 

I read on another forum that apparently the police had been involved at one time. Apparently he had confronted the thieves and they took no notice, so he came back with a rottie and a shot gun, hence the police involvement.

 

There are many ways he could have avoided this situation and still had control of who fished his water.

 

The wording of the two sentences you quoted,(I feel) are a big clue as to how his mind works.

 

John.

 

In the fishery owner's mind it would appear that it is OK to tar everyone with the same brush. That's where he broke the law. He could be prosecuted under Inclusion and Descrimination legislation....not to mention the implied threat of the shotgun.

[Dick Dastardly]

so he came back with a rottie and a shot gun, hence the police involvement.

 

Well what can I say...............

 

But who knows what they would have done in the same situation.To easy to sit back all nice and detached from the emotion of the situation and pass judgement though.

[JV44]

This makes me sick to be honest..

 

over 10 million people died in WWII due to the Nazis invading Poland. Britain along with many other countries helped free these people from the German oppressors.. now we are treating them with utter contempt complaining about the Eastern Europeans at every opportunity...

 

This guy needs shooting with his own **** and prosecuting to the full extent of the law.. he is no better than a Nazi....

 

The thing that most forget is that carp were brought to this country as a food source in the first place.......

 

Russia invaded Poland as well from the other side but we didnt go to war with them? well we nearly did over Finland but would that might have put us on the same side as Germany and another story bloody confusing war eh!! bit like life.

A couple of weekends ago i met a couple of Poles fishing a spot on the Thames fully equiped with unhooking mats and everything and saw them put back a couple of decent Chub in the evening so as they were fishing just below where we moored i had a chat when i walked the dog past them later that evening and what a revelation,decent guys and we had a few beers with them later on put the world to right and all.

Now up until this point my experience of EE has always been seeing large groups on the Thames or camped at the end bit of the kennet on the edge of Reading rubbish and bbqs abound along with the compulsory vodka bottles slurring in that gutral EE slant [that Budgie spoke of on the Thames nightfishing post] which is a bit intimidating to say the least and the chance of conflict with the wrong word is rife .

Now the local Chav populaion hasnt taken well to the EEs turning up on there fishing bits [on the Kennet esp] cutting down trees making big fires getting drunk threatening people and leaving lots of rubbish coz this is obviously there job and the EEs are nicking that to .

Based on what i see on my bits of the Thames and the kennet they turn up on mass to get p&^ss$d and catch fish to eat them in numbers just as well as the pike esp are left to deephook themselves as the rods are spread over a long length of bank in the evenings when they are to drunk to walk the river spinning anymore ,Often crispy remains on BBqs left where the fish has been caught cooked and not eaten due to mr Vodka bottle rendering them incapable esp on the lower kennet after forbury lock indian country to be sure.

By the sound of the other thread the Thames at marlow is no better and if anything a lot worse,We are taking the boat out for a week in September and are down that way then so i will get to see for myself , All the above are just what i see regularly on my bits of river not the angling press slant on it and i have no idea what happens elsewhere on other waterways.

Back to the original post the guy really shot himself in the foot by banning on block but without manpower then bailifing it must be a nightmare so have no idea of a solution, Have started to rethink my opinion of the smaller groups of EEs we see due to meeting the Couple of Poles the other day ,How fickle am i eh!! Life never black and white but Grey is so bloody confusing steve.

[Rusty]

There's a difference between the two sentences you quoted Rusty.

Then blame the source, I just copied and pasted.

 

He caught "some Polish anglers", but he put the notice up because "the Polish people are stealing my fish".

The second one infers that all Polish people steal fish, because he caught some Poles doing it. Poor logic to say the least.

I disagree, he could have been more careful with the wording e.g. "The Polish people fishing my fishery are stealing my fish" which I'm pretty sure is what he meant but then he's been quoted in the press and we all know how unreliable that can be.

 

I read on another forum that apparently the police had been involved at one time. Apparently he had confronted the thieves and they took no notice, so he came back with a rottie and a shot gun, hence the police involvement.

So he confronted them and they didn't have any respect for the fishery rules, at that point should he have called the police? What sort of priority do you think they would have assigned it?

 

There are many ways he could have avoided this situation and still had control of who fished his water.

Such as? He had no reason to stop them fishing before they stole fish. What should he have done after that?

 

The wording of the two sentences you quoted,(I feel) are a big clue as to how his mind works.

I repeat, I have lifted the text from the OP. If anyone is guilty of interpreting and conveying words to suit their own means it can only be the BBC.

 

I've had enough, it's a circular discussion now, at least we've proved that AN is a place where people can express different views without fear of the 'establishment' paying them a visit at 3:00am (4:00am maybe)

[gozzer]

Then blame the source, I just copied and pasted.

 

I was blaming the source, which I assume was the guy himself.

 

 

I disagree, he could have been more careful with the wording e.g. "The Polish people fishing my fishery are stealing my fish" which I'm pretty sure is what he meant but then he's been quoted in the press and we all know how unreliable that can be.

 

Maybe saying " Some Polish/Eastern Europeans fishing my fishery are stealing my fish", would have been more appropriate, (and accurate).

 

So he confronted them and they didn't have any respect for the fishery rules, at that point should he have called the police? What sort of priority do you think they would have assigned it?

 

Not as high a priority as a guy waving a shotgun about, I'm sure of that.

 

 

Such as? He had no reason to stop them fishing before they stole fish. What should he have done after that?

 

Anything from signage in the appropriate languages, to stop the "I no speak English, I not know" excuses, to devising an 'open membership scheme' where he can decide who 'joins'. Add screening before and during fishing, and he had at least tried other legal methods first.

 

I repeat, I have lifted the text from the OP. If anyone is guilty of interpreting and conveying words to suit their own means it can only be the BBC.

 

As I said earlier, I don't accuse you of 'twisting' any words or meanings. I can only go on what I've read from his interview.

 

I've had enough, it's a circular discussion now, at least we've proved that AN is a place where people can express different views without fear of the 'establishment' paying them a visit at 3:00am (4:00am maybe)

 

Most of us knew that already, but I'm glad you agree.

 

 

John