A balanced debate?

[Peter Waller]

Few of us can be unaware of the coverage that Angling Times gave to Peter Collins and his crusade against predators on the Fens. I have used the loose term of 'predators' because if you lay a night-line for zander you also lay a set-line for pike, eels and perch.

 

Did you think it was a balanced debate? I certainly didn't. The poor old EA were dragged into it, and promptly dug themselves a hole of epic proportions. But where was the balance to the article?

 

As has been pointed out on another thread 'specialist anglers' are now a major force in UK angling. So why not give a 'spezzi' a chance to defend the zander, to point out why Collins was wrong? I'm sure Nev Fickling could have presented a very strong case for the defence!

 

I can't help feeling that there is an underlying agenda to this one. Trouble is that both sides of the debate can, and probably will become entrenched, just what we need in the 'unity' stakes.

 

It has also been suggested that we don't attack Angling Times for their handling of this issue. As I read it it was about Collins against the zander, not Collins breaking the law and where the EA stands on this matter. In other words I am left wondering about the priorities on this one.

 

I have yet to write to AT, as has been suggested, on the matter of Collins and the EA. I'm not sure that I want to be drawn into what I consider to be an editorial tactic.

 

This isn't an instant decision. I've mulled it over for a week. In my opinion it was not a balanced debate. I question the motive behind the presentation. I don't think the handling of it is likely to advance unity within angling.

 

Collins, a hero or a villain, how did you read it? Well handled by AT? What do you think?

[Gareth.]

Peter,

You quiet rightly pointed out that the set lines put out for Zander are very indiscriminate. With the potential for capturing Pike, Perch, and Eels as well. The main reactions to this incident, have been generated by the "predator fishing community".

It is also a well recorded, that Carp and Bream will also pick up a deadbait. I would be interested to hear the remarks and reactions of Bream and Carp angler s towards the setting of dead lines for these species.

Being a Predator angler myself, I can understand why predator anglers find a lot more set lines than anglers practising other disciplines. The more mobile approaches, mini grappling hook shaped trebles and trolling. Increases the likelihood of coming into contact with the set lines.

However some of these set lines that I have come across, and subsequently destroyed, have been targeting the none predator species. They were very well made, better in fact than the Mono and treble with a piece of fish on, tied to a tree type, aimed at the Pike and Zander. that I regularly find. One in particular that I found one the Great Ouse was over 30 metres long, had 10 split shotted droppers of 2.5 metres long each. the first and the last droppers were baited with small boilies on the hook, the other 8 droppers with sweet corn and still wriggling worms. It could only have been put there for the purpose of catching the Bream and river Carp or Eels.

The main line was made up from some very thick mono and the droppers from what I estimate to be 12-15lb mono. It was very well staked along the margin drop off. and could only have been made and put there by someone who knew exactly what they were doing.

[mark barrett]

i doubt really once the two magazines started competing against themselves in the scoop stakes that a balanced debate was ever really likely. its a shame because to a point there has been a bit of a detraction from the original story, which was an appalling act. but it rumbles on further.

as for the EA beingdragged into it Pete i have no sympathy for this bunch of tossers at all. they were told about this before the guy was caught but chose to do nothing. furthermore they then compounded their incompetence by proclaiming that they probably wont prosecute as the gu is a pensioner. if there is one good thing to come from this debacle its that the EA has been exposed as the complete waste of time that it is.

[Newt]

I pass completely on the main topic here. Opinion but for a change (for me), no comment.

 

Gareth - you could be seeing some US import set lines. They are common here and some excellent ones are sold. A quick search on google for Trotline* or trotlines fish will show you lots of examples and most any US internet angling supply site will give hits if you search.

 

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[Vagabond]

surfacepopper:

However some of these set lines that I have come across,.........It was very well staked along the margin drop off. and could only have been made and put there by someone who knew exactly what they were doing.

It is puzzling as to what the motive for setting these is

 

1/ Sale of fish to a fishery ? Does not seem likely.

 

2/ Food ? Eels and carp maybe, but Bream??? (which you imply is the most likely catch)

 

3/ Wannabe famous? (ie someone wants a photo of a good catch) Hardly likely if the line is set "by someone who knows what they are doing" - they would be better off using their watercraft legitimately.

 

We get the occasional worm-baited nightline on our Wealden trout streams, but its never been a serious problem.

[Peter Waller]

I can't see bream as a food but I understand that some of our friends from Eastern Europe are quite keen on them, urghhh. But in fairness to Gareth's posting I must agree that us lure anglers do pick up set lines. I have also picked up illegally set fyke nets! But I would guess that most of these are set for eels, but inevitably they pick up other species. A size 6 hook baited with worms and lumps of mackeral is hardly discriminatory.

 

Mark, in the main I have little sympathy with the EA over this matter, they have behaved appallingly. My reading of the article was that they were brought into the affair seemingly to elevate Collins to some sort of obscure hero status. Seems Roy Marlow fell for it! From that point of view I do see them as having been dragged into the debate. Good job though, like nothing else it has highlighted the issue.

 

I personally think the theme of the article was Collin's and his crusade. In reality the story is one of the EA abysmally failing to do its duty. But that was not the way that it was presented.

 

The EA needed to be brought to account on this matter. But dragging 'em into it behind Collins was not, I think, the way to do it.

 

The question being posed was is Collins right to cull predators? Really it should have been a statement, The EA don't appear to want to prosecute a prominant law breaker. Perhaps the EA has some sympathy with zander killing?

 

[ 04. March 2004, 09:32 AM: Message edited by: Peter Waller ]

[Jon Hedges]

I completely agree with Mark. In fact Id go further and say that the EA are incompetent and ineffective in dealing with the majority of angling needs. They dredge rivers (no, they DON'T weed-cut), they fail to respond complaints / queries that don't fit their rigid plans and, once they have ruined our rivers by removing all bends and fish holding features, they come up with brilliant ideas like placing 3 wide concrete pipes in the main flow to allow fish to shelter. And no it seems that they fail to implement their own laws. T0ssers is not a strong enough word..