Can commercial fishermen and sea anglers work together?

[Leon Roskilly]

Is there an actual, (yet another), consultation on this taking place at the moment Leon?

 

 

What Bradshaw has recently said:

 

( http://www.anglers-net.co.uk/sacn/latest/index.php?view=617 )

 

I think the Sea Fisheries Committees themselves have recognised that they need to be modernised, both in their powers and in their membership.

 

In terms of who we mean by consulting: anybody who has an interest, apart from in the Sea Fisheries Committees themselves.

 

Now we have made the decision in principle to keep them, albeit reformed and perhaps rationalised in some way, we would like to hear from people as to what they would like the modern Sea Fisheries Committees to look like, what their membership should look like, what their functions should be and so on.

 

To me that is an open invitation for anyone to send in their own views (apart from the SFCs themselves)

 

They are also meeting with a number of stakeholders to discuss the modernisation of sea fisheries further.

 

I guess that there will be a consultation on definite proposals later, to which anyone will be able to respond, but right now it's about influencing what gets put on the table for those further discussions.

Edited July 31, 2006 by Leon Roskilly

[steve good]

What Bradshaw has recently said:

 

( http://www.anglers-net.co.uk/sacn/latest/index.php?view=617 )

To me that is an open invitation for anyone to send in their own views (apart from the SFCs themselves)

 

They are also meeting with a number of stakeholders to discuss the modernisation of sea fisheries further.

 

I guess that there will be a consultation on definite proposals later, to which anyone will be able to respond, but right now it's about influencing what gets put on the table for those further discussions.

 

hi leon

 

sfc if modernise or not will allways be inaffective.

 

sfc jurisdiction is at the moment only out to the six mile limit this means that they are under funded under manned for there areas, which are to LARGE to manage. plus a slow track byelaw system.

 

the councillors on the committes do not help they are just a hinderance when awake.

 

if the sfc get jurisdiction out to the 12 mile limit under modernisation the positon of there affectiveness will get alot worst

 

the thing is the navy do SOME fishery enforcement, DEFRA do SOME fishery enforcement, the sfc does SOME fishery enforcement and collectively it all adds up to nothing, nothing but a shambles

 

what is needed (a common sense thing) is one really affective enforcement body that is seperate from a really affective management group just like land police enforce our laws. our existing fragmentated management/enforcement groups collectively achieve little or nothing and will continue to do so unless a radical change in peoples thinking occurs

 

regards steve

[Steve Coppolo]

hi leon

 

sfc if modernise or not will allways be inaffective.

 

sfc jurisdiction is at the moment only out to the six mile limit this means that they are under funded under manned for there areas, which are to LARGE to manage. plus a slow track byelaw system.

 

the councillors on the committes do not help they are just a hinderance when awake.

 

if the sfc get jurisdiction out to the 12 mile limit under modernisation the positon of there affectiveness will get alot worst

 

the thing is the navy do SOME fishery enforcement, DEFRA do SOME fishery enforcement, the sfc does SOME fishery enforcement and collectively it all adds up to nothing, nothing but a shambles

 

what is needed (a common sense thing) is one really affective enforcement body that is seperate from a really affective management group just like land police enforce our laws. our existing fragmentated management/enforcement groups collectively achieve little or nothing and will continue to do so unless a radical change in peoples thinking occurs

 

regards steve

 

Blimey Steve, that's one of the most accurate and honest posts I've seen on this forum for a long time. I'm getting worried now as I seem to be nodding my head a lot when reading your posts lately.

[Ken Davison South Wales]

Blimey Steve, that's one of the most accurate and honest posts I've seen on this forum for a long time. I'm getting worried now as I seem to be nodding my head a lot when reading your posts lately.

 

I will second that.

 

Steve is right local politics have nothing to do with the marine inviroment, one central body policing out to twelve miles is the way to go, full accountability knowing exactly where the buck stops.

 

The current SFCs couldn't organise a p*** up in a brewery, you only have to look at the way our mob issued 1500 plus cockling licences for Pembry area, up shot total chaos costing the rate payers thousands of pounds and the eventual closing of Cyfen Sidan beach to permit holder vehicals which were not involved in the scandle.

[steve good]

Morning Leon

 

Quote

Marine Protected Areas, No Take Zones, Highly Protected Marine Reserves are the result of the failure by the wider industry, including fishermen, scientists, managers and politicians to protect the marine environment and fishstocks from unsustainable levels of exploitation, and damage to the seabed and the life that tries to live there.

I wish any one of those involved with the instigation of MPA's would take me out to sea and show me exactly were all this unsustainable levels of exploitation and damage to the sea bed is takeing place,

for I sure as hell can't find it and I don't know or can't think of any one area where it does.

 

hi peter

 

they are called aggregate dredging areas they look the same as a lunar landscape and are completly devoid of any sealife. 50% of it is exported to france and holland because they do not dredge there waters they let us do it

 

regards steve

[steve good]

Have read all through this thread again and come back to the original question, only this time I've come up with a slightly different answer.

 

Can commercial fishermen and sea anglers work together?

 

I have to now ask, work together for what?

 

Do we really want the same things? The more I read, the more I realise that we don't. Commercial fishermen and sea anglers are as far apart now as they ever were, if not more. Proposed conservation measures have really driven the wedge in there, and that in itself proves that we are miles apart when it comes to what we want from the fishery.

 

Can we work together? No we can't, and why should we?

 

hi steve

 

you are right the 2 sectors can not work together.

you ask why should we?

there is a very good reason why we should,it is called where there is a common interest that may affect both sectors:- such as aggregate dredging, marine nature reserves, and inadaquate policing/enforcement levels ect,ect,ect the list gos on and on.

 

regards steve

[steve good]

Have read all through this thread again and come back to the original question, only this time I've come up with a slightly different answer.

 

Can commercial fishermen and sea anglers work together?

 

I have to now ask, work together for what?

 

Do we really want the same things? The more I read, the more I realise that we don't. Commercial fishermen and sea anglers are as far apart now as they ever were, if not more. Proposed conservation measures have really driven the wedge in there, and that in itself proves that we are miles apart when it comes to what we want from the fishery.

 

Can we work together? No we can't, and why should we?

Proposed conservation measures have really driven the wedge in there

 

hi steve

 

no not really, it was the way it was done. eu level so as to affect all fisherman not just the uk would have support from some of the commercials

 

regards steve

[Steve Coppolo]

Hi Steve

 

It would be nice if we could work together, but I can't imagine how it would happen. We seem to be worlds apart when it comes to ideas about how to fix things. Every single conservation proposal that I've been involved with has been met with nothing but resistance from commercial fishermen, even when the measures don't affect them directly.

 

Don't get me wrong, I know commercial fishermen aren't two headed monsters, but you all seem to have this in-built defence mechanism that kicks in as soon as people start talking about changing things.

 

If there was a proposal to stop gill netting for red gurnard within epping forest, commercial fishermen would object and/or seek compensation. If the proposal was for restrictions on longlining for conger eels on the M25, commercial fishermen would object and/or seek compensation.

 

RSA reps might not be perfect, and they may have a lot to learn, but all the while commercial fishermen refuse point blank to co-operate or compromise, we won't ever be able to work together. Fishermen want things to be left alone, while sea anglers want things to change. Where's the common ground?

[steve good]

Hi Steve

 

It would be nice if we could work together, but I can't imagine how it would happen. We seem to be worlds apart when it comes to ideas about how to fix things. Every single conservation proposal that I've been involved with has been met with nothing but resistance from commercial fishermen, even when the measures don't affect them directly.

 

Don't get me wrong, I know commercial fishermen aren't two headed monsters, but you all seem to have this in-built defence mechanism that kicks in as soon as people start talking about changing things.

 

If there was a proposal to stop gill netting for red gurnard within epping forest, commercial fishermen would object and/or seek compensation. If the proposal was for restrictions on longlining for conger eels on the M25, commercial fishermen would object and/or seek compensation.

 

RSA reps might not be perfect, and they may have a lot to learn, but all the while commercial fishermen refuse point blank to co-operate or compromise, we won't ever be able to work together. Fishermen want things to be left alone, while sea anglers want things to change. Where's the common ground?

 

hi steve

 

what you say is fair enough, the way the fishing is now, and the fishing opportunities, commercial there is not alot of room for manouvie thats why commercials kicked over the bass plan. personally i do not think that there will be much of a fishing industry letf in 5 years time. the realality is commercials can not afford that common ground on conservation

 

regards steve

[Steve Coppolo]

hi steve

 

what you say is fair enough, the way the fishing is now, and the fishing opportunities, commercial there is not alot of room for manouvie thats why commercials kicked over the bass plan. personally i do not think that there will be much of a fishing industry letf in 5 years time. the realality is commercials can not afford that common ground on conservation

 

regards steve

 

That's fair enough Steve, thanks for an honest answer. It's not my place to say really, but maybe if things were changed a bit years ago, the industry wouldn't be up against it quite so much? I don't know.