Bolt rigs

[The Flying Tench]

Now to the other point, if a fish takes your bait and hook in its mouth then any subsequent movement can cause the hook point to catch on the flesh, the finer the point, the easier it is for the hook to penetrate (needle and nail? )

 

If the hook is "blunt" then this initial pricking may not occur, and the fish can reject the bait and hook.

 

Den

Thanks, Den, so - forgive my persistance - I think you are saying all ledger rigs are self-hooking to a degree (the fish is pricked), but you are not going so far as to say there is no need to strike. Am I hearing you right?

[The Flying Tench]

Like Den and John I have in the past done some practical experiments with running leads. There were so many variables that the results were inclusive, and I really must do some more before coming to any firm conclusions.

 

However I found that, at short range at least, running rigs did run. But only when a heavy lead was used!

 

Drat! And I've felt so comfortable with my quarter ounce leads, and I can cast them accurately with the floppiest quiver tips, too. And I guess I'm slightly puzzled, if the lead is getting moved, that the tip movements aren't more jerky. Also, i almost never get drop-back bites, which you'd expect if the lead was getting moved. I do use exceptionally flexible quiver tips, which could be a factor. Steve, how did you do your tests? Were they under water, or just on the garden lawn?

[The Flying Tench]

A brief "history" of the bolt rig (as I understand it anyway!) if its of any interest to John-

 

John,have you got a good hook sharpener? (by good I also mean one that you can use correctly easily) If not let me know and when Im next home I will try and sort you out a spare one and post it to you.

 

Budgie, thtank you ever so much for such an interesting write-up, which, as you say, puts a lot of things into place.

 

Re the hook sharpener, thank you, I'd be very grateful. I'll take the liberty of emailing you my address.

 

John

[Dick Dastardly]

I should still have it John.If not I will contact you.

[The Flying Tench]

Drat! And I've felt so comfortable with my quarter ounce leads, and I can cast them accurately with the floppiest quiver tips, too. And I guess I'm slightly puzzled, if the lead is getting moved, that the tip movements aren't more jerky. Also, i almost never get drop-back bites, which you'd expect if the lead was getting moved. I do use exceptionally flexible quiver tips, which could be a factor. Steve, how did you do your tests? Were they under water, or just on the garden lawn?

 

Well some more burble from me on this. With not much else to do on a wet bank holiday morning I set up a little experiment in my study. Not ideal, I'll admit.

 

I first set up the end section of a quiver tip rod, the most sensitive i have. I had a quarter oz lead lying on the carpet. Certainly, if I gave a 'bite' from any direction other than directly away from the rod, the lead moved, easily. But that clearly is different from when the lead is underwater, maybe wedged in some mud. In my study I couldn't 'wind in' to set up with any bend in the quiver at all, but in real life, when I cast, I can set up with considerable bend in the quiver. Let us say the tension in the line when I set up is x. In the worst case for moving the lead, when the fish is pulling the bait directly towards the bank, the pull on the line will be 2x when the tip first starts to move, and this will increase somewhat as the tip bends. So I would argue that, if you can set up with a considerable bend in the quiver, and then slacken off so there is almost no bend, there is a fair chance the weight won't move when you get a bite.

 

I'm not altogether disagreeing with Steve and Budgie. With a 1.5oz weight it didn't move even on the slippery carpet, so I accept that a 1.5 oz is better.

 

A more important point for me, though, is that I was surprised how easily, with my eyes shut and being a 'fish', I could feel the resistance from what I thought was a very sensitive quiver tip. A swing tip was better, though the problem with them in my limited experience is that, if you are fishing in even a few feet of water close in, it's difficult to get anywhere near the right angle between the tip and the line that you need for sensitive bite indication. Maybe I'll have to try bobbins again. For some reason I haven't enjoyed using them, finding them fiddly, but that's probably just lack of experience.

 

A lesser point is that, when the weight did move over the carpet, i couldn't feel it at all! But I guess that would have been different if it had been dragged over gravel.

[cobra]

ok with a risk of sounding dim im not a specialist carp angler so can you explain these rigs for the noobs to this type of fishing like me please sorry for being a bit dumb

[gozzer]

ok with a risk of sounding dim im not a specialist carp angler so can you explain these rigs for the noobs to this type of fishing like me please sorry for being a bit dumb

 

Here you are cobra, some info' courtesy of Gaffer.

 

http://www.anglersnet.co.uk/Rig-Section/Ca...g_for_carp.html

 

There is more info' if you go to home page and click on 'Carp Rigs'.

 

As Elton keeps saying "there's more to AN than just the forums".

 

John.

[cobra]

Here you are cobra, some info' courtesy of Gaffer.

 

http://www.anglersnet.co.uk/Rig-Section/Ca...g_for_carp.html

 

There is more info' if you go to home page and click on 'Carp Rigs'.

 

As Elton keeps saying "there's more to AN than just the forums".

 

John.

thanks mate i recon it should band to use the fixed rig if it can kill the fish