Trebles

[Dick Dastardly]

A couple of comments on points raised so far.

 

Steve remember when I told you of the problems I had with Perch "tail nipping" strong lives such as Rainbows or carp? I tried using a small (size 14-12) sea trout fly treble mounted below a single (a bit like a reversed Pike anglers "Uni rig")

It solved the problem of tail nipping and despite never having had a problem with either "out of mouth" or deep hooking I stopped for fear of these two things.As weve disscussed I often wonder If maybe I was a bit quick to stop using them as the rig certainly avoided the risk of deep penetration related injury/damage.

 

Tony,other than depth of penetration (and thats all relative to the actual size of the single being usaed) to a certain degree several of the other problems I have concerns over re singles can be avoided by a bit of thought and self discipline.Compared with a (generally recognised as such) standard size 6 treble a 1/0 could be argued not to be "over large".Trouble is of course that its really bait size that dictates the size of hook required isnt it?

 

Bluerinse,coincidently a lot of my early Zed fishing was done abroad (Germany) and with singles.Once again bait to hook size ratio being important.

 

Small baits for pike are in my experience not so effective and also increase the chance of deep hooking.Therefore big baits are used and bigger singles are required and back to the initial problem!

 

Circles,well Ive now live baited,deadbaited and lure fished with them and the jury is still out! some situations they work fine others not so good.As such Ive yet to see a valid reason for switching to them but still playing!

 

What the biggest problem with this perenial argument is IMHO guys who are experienced/confident pikers very rarely have problems with trebles.Basicly because they have learned to use them and are well versed in removing them where ever they end up! People who havnt this experience/confidence cant and therefore look to alternatives. I know that what drove my experiments many years ago!

 

Just strikes me as ironic that guys looking for the best way to minimise damage may be in actual fact causing/increasing it!

[Dick Dastardly]

I have found hook size preferance Regional the langstone Langstone skippers I use promote huge meat hook type hooks

And 250lb BS mono for tope fishing But I have caught eqaul sized fish in the Thames Estuary on 3/0s and lighter mono(sorry Folks back to course fishing now) I think its what you feel confident with. The worry is fish Gourging the hooks I have found carefull hook placement helps some way with this but it is a problem that concerns me.

 

Once again bait size is the main factor in selecting hook size surely?

 

Over 40 years of angling has taught me that no rig,no hook,no method will avoid a swallowed hook 100%We must do all we can to minimise this obviously but as we cant totally prevent it we need to make sure we can deal with it when it does happen.

[Houseplant]

I am thinking of using a Pennel type rig this winter for my deadbaiting I will try one type with circle hooks and the with O' Shaughnessy J type hooks, it will be basically a much scaled down Shark Rig.

The only problem I can see will be that the hook sizes will have to be increased over my standard size 6 trebles to a 1-1/0, which may or may not cause more damage to a Pike's mouth other views on this would be appreciated.

 

Tony

 

no one has mentioned hook gauge yet. i go for the lightest circles i can find. current batch is from NZ and working very well. similar to the owner mutu light, but lighter

[Will Wilkinson]

I use semi-barbed trebles for deadbaiting (don't livebait for pike myself - the size of livebait needed for decent fish is too often my quarry when general fishing on most of the waters I fish) and doubles on lures.

 

I agree with Budgie on the use of singles - the size needed for the baits used is just too large and leads to overly-deep penetration.

 

However I much prefer doubles on plugs and spinners - I don't fish a larger hook when doing this and have found the fish (particularly smaller specimens) are much easier to unhook as even if both points have set they can be removed with the same direction of pull unlike a treble if all 3 points engage. I first started using doubles on lures when game fishing where the smaller mouths magnify any difficulty unhooking and had led me to take fish that I might otherwise have released (2-3lb fish on rivers where I don't usually keep anything under 4lb). Since then I've moved to using them for pike and perch and found that I hook just as many fish and that unkooking is easier, particularly in more awkward hook holds. I'd not go back to trebles on lures. I also use micro-barbed or barbless doubles on lures, depending on hook and lure size - barbless for big lures, micro-barb (often home-altered by filing down the original barb) on smaller lures that may be taken by perch.

 

Will

[zedhead]

my opinion is very much the same as budgies and steves on this, I will add though that for most of my piking (where it is practical like drains and canals) I have been using a single semi barbless treble trace for the past 3 years and I must say this has been superb for hooking and unhooking, 9 times out of 10 the pike is hooked bang in the scissors. I would urge those that havent tried this arranegement to do so, again this obviously is no good for distance casting but for fishing upto 40 yards I have nothing but confidence in it.

[Neil G]

my opinion is very much the same as budgies and steves on this, I will add though that for most of my piking (where it is practical like drains and canals) I have been using a single semi barbless treble trace for the past 3 years and I must say this has been superb for hooking and unhooking, 9 times out of 10 the pike is hooked bang in the scissors. I would urge those that havent tried this arranegement to do so, again this obviously is no good for distance casting but for fishing upto 40 yards I have nothing but confidence in it.

 

Agree with the above....really good setup

 

Not actually too bad for distance casting coupled with some bait bands to take the weight off the hook or with a pop up trace threaded through the bait.

[UK_Ozzie]

Try a Oshaunessy hook style in about a 6/0 depending on the size of the bait.

Chop 25% off the tail end of the fish bait. Thread the hook through the tail pull out other side then place the hook through the gill so the point sits exposed out the other side. You can also snood a smaller 2/0 and set it through the top of the tail end.

When the fish swallows the bait head first the hook will be set up with the point in the correct position to get a true set.

[bingo]

What the biggest problem with this perenial argument is IMHO guys who are experienced/confident pikers very rarely have problems with trebles.Basicly because they have learned to use them and are well versed in removing them where ever they end up! People who havnt this experience/confidence cant and therefore look to alternatives. I know that what drove my experiments many years ago!

 

Just strikes me as ironic that guys looking for the best way to minimise damage may be in actual fact causing/increasing it!

 

How true! Agree with you completely.

 

If it ain't broke.......................

[noodle996]

Try a Oshaunessy hook style in about a 6/0 depending on the size of the bait.

Chop 25% off the tail end of the fish bait. Thread the hook through the tail pull out other side then place the hook through the gill so the point sits exposed out the other side. You can also snood a smaller 2/0 and set it through the top of the tail end.

When the fish swallows the bait head first the hook will be set up with the point in the correct position to get a true set.

 

If you try that for pike you will end up gut hooking them and with a hook that size you are looking at causing real damage to a pike

I am a big fan of singles for piking mostly when using lives though

[Neil G]

I did experiment with singles but with not much luck so have returned to the trusted single treble.

 

As above..if it ain't broke....