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Its an issue that some folk, from both sides of the fence, can and do get remarkably uptight about.

 

Are not the Leney carp that Donald Leney introduced to waters, such as Redmire, the offsprings of 'foreign' fish? In other words if we can colonise in this way then why not add new blood to breeding stocks by importing new 'foreign' fish?

 

On a downside I think it remarkably unsporting of some UK anglers to remove specimen fish from someone elses waters as a selfish means of improving their own private fishing.

 

The health factor. Perhaps rather like the risk of disease transfer issue associated with livebait movements? It hasn't happened, or has it? I'm not qualified on this one so the question has to be 'is it worth the risk?'

 

On reflection the anglers concerned should suffer all the fates suggested by Bruno plus the public humiliation of having to fish their ultra-cult syndicate water whilst sat on an illuminated blue plastic tackle box and using a complete Argos set-up, preferably non matching.

 

[ 13. November 2002, 08:30 AM: Message edited by: Peter Waller ]

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Morning, I had to add my thoughts as well. Some of the points addressed have not mentioned that introducing fish into natural ecosystems that don't already have them are damaging to species that may or may not be endangered. While working on a national wildlife refuge in Oregon, we tried to eradicate an introduced species of carp that had destroyed the plants by rooting which in turn, destroyed the habitat for native trout. In the states when you are in violation of hunting or fishing requirements they can (and usually do) take all of your equipment, including vehicles and everything in them. They may also suspend your rights as a hunter or angler for years. Quarantine the fish? Why spend the pounds on a fish if you could take it back? Unless we are talking about jobs which could be an entirely different issue. Have I opened a can of worms or what? Personally I think the stiffer the penalty the better. Hang'em or better yet use the diamond method...

Jeff

 

Piscator non solum piscatur.

 

Yellow Prowler13

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Ask me at 75...

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the death of the head of the organisation ,that ofcourse is mr blair who`s ultimatly responsible for all bad things either through his activity or non activity in all things ,after all ignorance is not an excuse in law. just because he`s not at every port , aerodrome and train station searching for fish is not an excuse :mad:

on the other hand its a criminal offence ,all proceeds ,items bought with proceeds and items used to procure proceeds are forfit ,and ofcourse the family living in houses bought on the proceeds are guilty to for harbouring the perpitrator , send them to devils island ....no wait we probably would have to pay to go there for a holiday ,send them to sheppy :D

Believe NOTHING anyones says or writes unless you witness it yourself and even then your eyes can deceive you

None of this "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" crap it just means i have at least two enemies!

 

There is only one opinion i listen to ,its mine and its ALWAYS right even when its wrong

 

Its far easier to curse the darkness than light one candle

 

Mathew 4:19

Grangers law : anything i say will  turn out the opposite or not happen at all!

 

"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical." Thomas Jefferson

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peter, your question of "it hasn't happened yet, or has it?" sorry, were you reffering to the fact that you were unsure that foreign fish can import disease?

 

well, as a kent resident, i can assure you that they can. sadly, SVC has cropped up from time to time in my area. this has now been dubbed Spring Carp Mortality Syndrome I believe (Bruno will no doubt correct me) Before the in-rush of foreign carp in the 80s, mass Carp deaths were not that common.

 

My personal disgust at the import of large foreign fish, has led to me choosing not to fish waters where I know such fish have been introduced (there are several well known Kent Carp waters, which I do not now fish, although I fished them regularly, before foreign fish were introduced).

 

You are perfectly correct when you say that the Redmire original fish were all imports. However, Leney chose the healthiest, fastest growing fish from broods of thousands. They were then stocked into ponds which didn't hold stocks of Carp already (by and large).

 

When big fish are brought in, they are frequently stolen from someone else's water (thus spoiling their fishing) with no health checks. they are usually brought in, to suppliment an existing stock, which can then turn "belly up".

 

It's pretty much like the scenario in the amazonian jungle, where the common cold was unheard of, until the arrival of the white man. After explorers arrived and passed on the disease, several native tribes were wiped out in short order.

 

As far as the scum bags who get caught bringing fish in these days, well I don't believe they should be sent to prison or fined. They should be made to work as Traffic Wardens in London. That way everyone will be able to hate them openly and treat them as Pariahs.

Dunk Fairley

Fighting for anglers' rights - Join SAA today at http://www.saauk.org

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you are right that those who commit this type of crime should be punished ...... but to put them in jail would be pointless apart from the prison system over here being full (72000 at present and predicted to be 74000 + by May next year). I believe that the best form of punishment for those would be A) a very heavy Fine.

B) confiscate their passport.

c)Community Service

 

Community Service could be something like clearing & weeding all the local rivers and canal tow paths and verges for a period of two years every weekend.

 

thats my thoughts on the subject

BOB

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its not called community service nowadays its called (by blair) community punishment , its just the same as comunity service ,work hard when your watched ,lark about and cadge cups of tea from old ladies whose garden your cleaning , but now the word punishment is used the general public think that its hard labour in disquise ,its not ,hard labour is building new prisons for future crims :) or gang work under constant supervision doing usefull work not cleaning gutters so the council can cut back on street cleaners :mad:

Believe NOTHING anyones says or writes unless you witness it yourself and even then your eyes can deceive you

None of this "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" crap it just means i have at least two enemies!

 

There is only one opinion i listen to ,its mine and its ALWAYS right even when its wrong

 

Its far easier to curse the darkness than light one candle

 

Mathew 4:19

Grangers law : anything i say will  turn out the opposite or not happen at all!

 

"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical." Thomas Jefferson

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Dunk, I think I know most of the waters that you are referring to and most of the carp in them were IMPORTED by the old Kent River Board. In fact they imported over 50000.

 

But that does not mean that later i.e. 1980's onward,imports have not caused problems, although the lakes that are rumoured to have the most have suffered the least, which is why the owners allegedly, continue to import fish illegally.

 

I do not condone this practise but surely none of these owners would risk losing stock worth maybe a million pounds or more?

 

A couple of the lakes near Larkfield did suffer, but these were legally imported fish.

 

Den

"When through the woods and forest glades I wanderAnd hear the birds sing sweetly in the trees;When I look down from lofty mountain grandeur,And hear the brook, and feel the breeze;and see the waves crash on the shore,Then sings my soul..................

for all you Spodders. https://youtu.be/XYxsY-FbSic

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Den,

 

I knew that the old KRB imported a lot of fish. It was not just the Illegally imported fish of the 80s which I believe caused a lot of the problems. A LOT of the problems were in fact caused by LEGALLY imported fish.

 

Unfortunately, the importation laws were found to be too lax on the health check front, but by then a lot of the damage had been done.

 

One place which was spoilt in my view was the Darenth complex. Alright, the big fish present were old (Leney stock), but when it changed hands the place was re-arranged fishing wise. A load of big fish were imported (totally legally) and put into one lake, just so people could catch a 30.

 

At the time this was going on, there were very few breeders of carp in this country. To grow a fish to 30lb plus was virtually impossible. I remember the angling weeklies running a story about a 30lb fish being netted from an estate lake and then being sold for £3500 (I believe they called it Penny). A 30lb carp was incredibly rare back then, so a lake where one was virtually guarenteed, was a very good buisness proposition.

 

Nowadays, a few idiots have decided they want their own 30s lake, so they go over and steal them, without regard for the health of the fish.

 

We have to bear in mind of course, that a lot of the fish in france for instance, were originally stocked into the huge French Barrages (resevoirs) as a food source.

 

Anyway, back to Bruno's point.....

 

Off with their goolies!!!

Dunk Fairley

Fighting for anglers' rights - Join SAA today at http://www.saauk.org

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this is from a mere female of the species so don't laugh :P but if the monks in medevial times had carp ponds where the heck did the carp come from, :P as for the wire treatment would that be an essential new skill for me to aquire for dealing with violent/abusive patients nursejudyXXXXXXX

nurse.gif

 

AKA Nurse Jugsy ( especially for newt)

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