choo choo, Fairbrass edits his comments!

[Dick Dastardly]

"What is wrong with decent mixed fisheries?"

 

Kind of somes up my view...... but sadly I am very much in the minority these days. The modern angler is quite simply a "carp angler" easy as that . Anyone who cant see this either doesn't ever visit a tackle shop,go to a variety of waters or simply leave his house after taking his head out of a 1960's edition of Anglers Mail! To the vast majority carp angling is angling. So once this is realised the answers to the question are-

 

Other fish take your bait intended for carp

Other fish eat the food intended for carp

Other fish stop your fishery being such an "exclusive" fishery and therefore limiting how much you can charge

 

So that is "What is wrong with decent mixed fisheries?" in the mid of modern "angling"

 

Regarding highly managed "specialist" Coarse fishing waters....well I've never seen any yet! Wingham was the only one ever that I know of but as indeed Wingham shows such a fishery in todays "angling" is simply not viable long term. Simple economics and market forces not allowing this type of venture. Sadly I think Wingham (unless another one of us "allrounders" wins the Lottery and has the balls and total disregard to personal gain that Steve Burke did to run such a project) will be a very unique one off that wont be there for ever and certainly not repeated.

 

Yes to a degree the "Carp Machine" (be it big carp,match carp or the carp mags or carp companies) is to blame but ultimately it is US the non carp blinded all rounders or non carp specialists or just general "pleasure anglers" (a very rare beast these days) that's to blame simply because we are not prepared to pay the same price to persue our chosen way of fishing as they are theirs.

 

So maybe rallying the troops to defend "angling" against Danny's Carp Machine (as well as being totally pointless) is simply not the way? maybe we need to simply just put our hands in our pockets a bit deeper? But I fear its now to late the Carp Machine is now so much in power we are now such a minority that we simply wont have enough like minded people to compete financially.

 

I see the likes of myself (hopefully not in my life time) being reduced (or should I say "returning"?) to the little farm ponds and dissuaded stretches of canal and river to fish. Doesn't sound to bad does it maybe....but of course others will be forced to do this as well and not like minded anglers but carp anglers who cant afford to fish "carp waters"! and they them selves will try to turn our sanctuaries into their own "carp waters" by illegal stocking/removal of fish! we (the general/all round.non carp specialist angler) just wont win.......but hey its a mute point because by this stage "we" wont even exists!

 

EDIT: By WE I mean the non carp only angler not just us ourselves.

Edited May 14, 2014 by Dick Dastardly

[Dales]

I don't have a problem with fencing. It's more the process of aggressively acquiring mixed fisheries and turning them into carp-only venues I don't like the sound of.

 

i agree we have more then enough Carp fisheries but if Dan is going to lease or buy waters it makes sense to buy those that are failing (from a business point of view). Why would he purchase a top mixed fishery fished by "coarse anglers" and making sufficent funds to keep its vested interest happy.

 

Like all walks of life, Its a case or use it or loose. Those gems that are little fished and don't make economic sense to owners may well be under a great threat but thats the same with any product. i think coarse anglers need to loose those rose tinted glasses and accept that fishing is a commodity like everything else in life. If enough people use a fishery and it makes enough cash to keep its vested interests happy then why would Dan be able to take it over?

 

Coarse angling is now in a minority but we expect everyone to pander to us and provide the sort of sport we want. It is not going to happen, if we loose good mixed fisheries then it will be because they no longer make economic sense. As for clubs well will not the members need to vote for this?

[gozzer]

Spoken like a true accountant Stephen.

 

John.

[Dales]

Spoken like a true accountant Stephen.

 

John.

 

i don't like it much more then any one else does but I can view it from an economic point of view, which is the way that most owners of a water will.

[Steve Walker]

In other words, little lads who want to go fishing for roach and perch need to get used to paying carp syndicate prices or lose their fishing?

 

I do see a problem with the economic argument, though - massively increasing the supply of big carp waters will crash their market value.

[Dales]

I do see a problem with the economic argument, though - massively increasing the supply of big carp waters will crash their market value.

 

But if consumers want a certain product it makes sense to provide it, bottom line in my mind is that not enough anglers want coarse fishing and those that do are not prepared to pay high prices for it. I don't like it but I believe its the truth.

 

This thread may be about still waters but how many clubs are giving up rivers and canals because not enough members use them and so it does not make economic sense to keep them on their books.

Edited May 14, 2014 by Dales

[Andy Macfarlane]

That would be quite something Steve. Can you imagine it? Derelict carp fisheries with homeless bums living in ancient bivvies round the place.

 

"When I were a lad, this place was full of 50lb Carp. Now it's all just Perch"

[gozzer]

All this begs the question.... was there a 'need' for more carp before their introduction, or did their introduction create the 'need'?

 

John.

[gozzer]

carp fisheries with homeless bums living in ancient bivvies round the place.

 

That's not too far from the reality of some places I know Andy.

 

John.

[Steve Walker]

It would probably make economic sense to fill most fisheries in and build shopping malls on them. We don't, principally because there is regulation to stop it. We have to ask who would regulate converting mixed fisheries to carp holding facilities. The Environment Agency is the first thing that springs to mind - movement of fish and the section 30 system. Does anybody know the grounds under which a section 30 can be denied?