Strength of knots

[Barry Kneller]

Well, I've done a few more tests with my 6lb Bayer Perlon, and it is all very strange. I soaked the line for about an hour, and fully expected it to become weaker, but it became stronger. And when the line dried off it became stronger still! So whereas a couple of weeks ago, with dry line (apart from moistening the knot) the half blood and uni knots broke at 3.5 - 4 lbs, when the line was soaked they broke at 5.5 - 6lbs, and then when it had dried again they broke at around 7lbs! All the knots were the same (ie close to 6lbs), though I haven't tried the rapala yet, and I've realised it won't be possible to do the knotless knot on my set-up as I am tying the line to a swivel.

 

I don't know what to make of this. I have nearly finished the line, so will repeat the tests with some different line when I get a chance. Meanwhile it will be interesting to see what Barry comes up with.

 

 

Very Strange, can't explain that at all - I've never done tests with the line soaked but conventional wisdom suggests that mono always loses strength when wet, maybe this is not so??

 

Can't do any tests at the moment, the rig is fixed to the workshop door & because of an accumulation of junk I can't get within 3 feet of it at the moment.......

 

Cheers

Barry

[Dick Dastardly]

Well, I've done a few more tests with my 6lb Bayer Perlon, and it is all very strange. I soaked the line for about an hour, and fully expected it to become weaker, but it became stronger. And when the line dried off it became stronger still! So whereas a couple of weeks ago, with dry line (apart from moistening the knot) the half blood and uni knots broke at 3.5 - 4 lbs, when the line was soaked they broke at 5.5 - 6lbs, and then when it had dried again they broke at around 7lbs! All the knots were the same (ie close to 6lbs), though I haven't tried the rapala yet, and I've realised it won't be possible to do the knotless knot on my set-up as I am tying the line to a swivel.

 

I don't know what to make of this. I have nearly finished the line, so will repeat the tests with some different line when I get a chance. Meanwhile it will be interesting to see what Barry comes up with.

 

How olds the line your using John? I ask as the top few layers may have been affected by UV light.

 

Another strange (worrying) observation about the breaking strain of mono.When I had the tackle company "Qwik Rigs" we used a 60lb mono supplied dyed to a colour of my choice by Brent. It came on 1kg spools (no idea of the length!) litterally hundreds upon hundreds of sea rigs would be made from one spool.On thing that all the rigs had in common was that a Mustad easy link was tied (uni knot) on the bottom to attach the lead to.When this knot was tightened a skewer was passed through the liunk,the knot mopistened and pulled tight by wrapping a few turns of line around the other hand.Every now and again the knot would snap!...............

 

REMEMBER we are talking 60lb line here!! no way can you break 60lb line with your hands!! the knot would be retied and would quite often break again.A few metres of line would be stripped off and discarded and every thing would be back to normal for another load of rigs.

 

As part of the manufacturing process involved the use of crimps slid on the line you would also notice (as they were quite a snug fit) variations in the diameter of the line. These though didnt necessarily correspond with the "weak" segments of the line.

 

Not a problem for what I was doing but often thought that I would be a bit **** off if I had loaded up one of my wrecking/big game reels only to have a weak spot half way down it!

[The Flying Tench]

How olds the line your using John? I ask as the top few layers may have been affected by UV light.

Hard to think it was u/v light. The line has been kept in a box in the garage, and there were only a few turns of line left on the spool anyway - the recent tests would have had more or less the same light as the ones a couple of weeks ago. I suspect there is something EERILY SUPERNATURAL going on with this particular line!

 

I did another test with the 6lb line today for the rapala knot. Broke at 7lbs, for what it's worth.

[Vagabond]

. I'm of the opinion that if a knot parts with a fish, it was a poorly tied knot, no matter what it was.

 

There is a lot of truth in that, and I would go further and say I suspect that of those who decry the grinner, most are not tying it properly, in particular, not ensuring the turns snug down neatly before tightening the knot up.

 

Like Budgie, I believe in keeping things simple. The only "tests" I have ever done is compare one knot against the other - ie tie a yard of line to one end of a swivel with knot A, tie another yard of the same line to t'other end of the swivel with knot B

 

Wrap each piece of line several times round a stout stick, take a stick in each hand and pull like hell until one of the knots breaks.

 

That way, you know how the knots that YOU tied in that particular piece of line compare.

 

The results tell you which knot is best FOR YOU - it may be because one knot is inherently better than another OR it may be that you are tying one type of knot badly.

 

I am not the slightest bit interested in how knots tied by someone else behave, because it is MY knots I fish with.

 

When Dick Walker told me about the grinner in the sixties, and Pete Grundel wrote an article on the Palomar in AT about the same time. the first thing I did was to compare those two knots with the tucked half-blood, and with each other, using the method above. Been using the grinner ever since.

 

BTW A good method of ruining a spring balance is to use it to test knots to destruction. The sudden release of tension when the line breaks is bad news for the spring. One of my "scientific" friends found that out the hard way.

[Guest tigger]

I started using the Grinner knot 2yrs ago and prefer it to any others. I've also done tests similar to your own and found the Grinner to be the superior knot.

I have total confidence it the Grinner knot and have not been snapped off by a fish while using it.

[The Flying Tench]

BTW A good method of ruining a spring balance is to use it to test knots to destruction. The sudden release of tension when the line breaks is bad news for the spring. One of my "scientific" friends found that out the hard way.

 

Thanks for the warning. I have destroyed a Waymaster balance (my usual scales) in a slightly different way, but am quite sure this would also do the trick. However the old balance I use for the line testing appears virtually indestructible - and I check it's accuracy against the Waymaster from time to time, and it's OK.

[Guest tigger]

I've only just realised this is the knot I've been using Uni/Grinner Knot . I think it's a uni knot. I've been calling it a grinner knot as that is what it said it was on the instructions for my Power pro braid. I still find this knot to be spot on.