And some of you said Fishing was safe from attack!

[kleinboet]

Peter, I am not shooting you down in flames, but I can assure you that had you seen the secret film of a hunt where the fox was cornered by the dogs and then literally torn apart screaming by those same dogs. This is the one film that the pro-hunt lobby wishes will go away!

[Alan Roe]

Yoxer what I fail to see coming from you is any valid comment on the main point that I have made and have been making for a very long time now both on this and other sites that I visit.

That is the best way to go is to expose the antis that lie behind the campaigns for what they are there is sufficient matierial there to keep them busy and on the back foot for a long time to come .

Further we should use the same weapons that they use in the form of emotive language.

The great mistake is to even bother defending angling for in doing that you had control of the agenda to our foes.

[Cranfield]

quote:

---

Got to butt in here...apart from what YOU BELIEVE to be the case, could any one please come up with a simple and sensible argument that will counter the antis who will claim that causing ANY discomfort to fish is unacceptable?

 

Den

---

As poledark says, what are the arguments we should use, Alan ?

[Zigs]

fish don't have evolved brains capable of experiencing pain as higher animals do.

 

man has hunted fish for food since the first time we saw one swimming.

 

if we dont catch them, plenty of other animals ( including fish ) will.

 

bass eat other, smaller, bass.

 

if shore fishing is banned then commercial fishing has to go too, along with the import of fish from all other countries.

[Cranfield]

ziggy, your first point could likely be disproved, by alternative scientific argument.

 

The response to the rest would be, "so what ?".

You could even apply most of it to fox hunting.

 

Lets hope it doesn't happen in our lifetime, but I was one of those that thought hunting with hounds would never be banned.

[yoxer]

"Yoxer what I fail to see coming from you is any valid comment on the main point that I have made and have been making for a very long time now both on this and other sites that I visit."

 

My apologies Alan , I havnt seen your main point , perhaps you care to post it again and it will receive my full attention.

You can expose the anti's for exactely what you think they are , you can make them look like brainless idiots , you can let the public think they are the scub of the earth , and it will not make one bit of difference if you can not refute the claim that angling ie draging a fish around its natural enviroment by a hook and line , causes a fish to suffer distress and pain , regardless of how minimal you care to think that pain is.

[yoxer]

"For pity's sake will you lot all wake up!stop snivelling about the demise of angling and start activly working on the demise of the antis expose them for the hypocritical shower of crypto faschists that they really are!!!!"

 

ah , the very accusation that would be leveled straight back at you for which you have sod all of a defense .

[yoxer]

"if shore fishing is banned then commercial fishing has to go too, along with the import of fish from all other countries."

 

You miss the point entirely . Fox hunting has not been banned. There is no need to ban commercial fishing.People need to eat,which I think is the ONLY justification anglers can present.

If angling is to be restricted or even banned , it will be resticted or banned on the perception that it is cruel and barbaric in exactley the same way that hounds tearing up a fox is cruel and barbaric and is not neccessary. We do not eat foxes and especialy after theyve been torn to bits. Those that would try the justifacation of " ah but we caring anglers let the fish go again after catching it " only compound the perception of suffering and distressed caused and do no favours whatsoever by stating this.

The justifaction of angling for food on the table is as already stated , a weak one , but I personaly think its the only one going for it with at least a bit of credability, and as long as the public are still buying battery hens , veal , etc etc etc , then no one can point an accusing finger without the absurdities being apparently clear to all.

[kleinboet]

Yoxer - I already have! May be you should read the posts before trying to think up ways to needle forum members.

[yoxer]

Oh right , so when public opinion is stirred up your going to ask the instigaters "how come we can catch the same fish several times within hours? " Do you realy need me to tell how they are going to reply to this [Edited - There's no need to get personal] ?

 

[ 24. November 2004, 07:22 PM: Message edited by: John S ]