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Scotty T

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Yoxer, you clearly disagree with the reasons for going to war, which I fully respect.

 

However, questioning a soldier (who is employed to follow orders) and blaming him/her directly for the conflict is hardly fair.....Again, if you have been to Iraq and can fully appreciate the life of a soldier I could respect those comments, however, from an outsiders point of view I don't think we have any business questioning the 'front-line' squaddie.

 

Remember they can only return fire - that means potentially every time one dons his uniform, he can take the bullet that the others respond to. It takes some guts to do that every day and if in one (or lets be honest) several incidents the guys have over-reacted then frankly I cannot blame them too much. As I said, worse happens here on a Friday night and yet the media are happy to ignore this because it doesn't sell papers!

 

With respect to the soldiers being as bad as Saddam then that is a comment of plain ignorance. Millions upons millions of people suffered directly as a result of ONE MANS regime. If you want to compare the suffering of the Iraqi people as a whole since the conflict started then that is no individual soldiers fault, but the fault of the governments of the UK and US. Each individual soldier - including those involved in the videos etc - was brave enough to at least walk out in a uniform because his country asked him to. That is commendable - hopefully we will never need the services of our armed forces at home in our lifetimes but if we do then I lay every penny I have that anyone criticising them now will be happy to take their assistance!!!!!


Ian W

 

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its reconed a million iraqi kids (unknown number of adults)have died (only reconned as civilian casualties dont count as casualties ) in the ten years of sanctions inposed by the west ,then theres the uprising we started by the shiites getting put down ,more in the daily bombings in the same ten years by the west (seemingly forgoten by the western papers) .

then we have this little scuffle (civilian casualties dont count as casualties so are ignored)

so who is the best killer of iraqi's ,saddam over 30 years or us (either by direct action ,getting the shiites picked on for following our advice or for allowing the "insurgants" to act with little fear) over 13 ,i bet theres no difference infact in mass graves i bet we just have the edge.

the sanctions started after the first iraq war (shall we include those deaths as well) because saddam invaded a country ,something that the west does all the time :rolleyes:

the fist war was based on truth ,saddam indeed invaded another country (forget we do it frequently) the second was based on a pack of lies ,and critisise saddam although in regarding his weapon stockpile he was the only person that told the truth :rolleyes:

 

then we have the millions upon millions put in fear and dread in letting the jews get a foothold in isreal , saddam was good compared to the west :rolleyes:

 

terrorists we dont deal with them errr just a minute isreal was founded using terror bombing and murder ,double standards

no terrorists under saddam ,plenty now ,double standards

 

what the fight is about is oil and subterfuge ,we enslave the arabs isreal then expands ,problem solved ,isreal wins we get the last of the oil we win

Edited by chesters1

Believe NOTHING anyones says or writes unless you witness it yourself and even then your eyes can deceive you

 

There is only one opinion i listen to ,its mine and its ALWAYS right even when its wrong

 

Its far easier to curse the darkness than light one candle

 

Mathew 4:19

Grangers law : anything i say will  turn out the opposite or not happen at all!

 

"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical." Thomas Jefferson

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" It takes some guts to do that "

No it dosnt , it only requires stupidity

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Guest Brumagem Phil
Millions upons millions of people suffered directly as a result of ONE MANS regime.

 

That statement alone is open to plenty of interpretation.

 

Governments as a matter of course think of themselves and their military muscle first....and thats a FACT. If you disagree then imagine where you car would be if there was an oil embargo.........thats right, it'd be in the garage cos the military would get first crack at the fuel...and the food if that was in short suppy, and the medicine if that was scarce too.

 

The point is, whilst what saddam did was cruel and sad during his decade of sanctions, dont insult your own intelligence by assuming your own government would act differently.........the only saving grace you have is that its not been put to the test, but rationing during the wars suggests my reasoning isnt far from the truth!

 

Some of the top political analysts who either knew or have studied saddam have said that he (as opposed to his sons and a few other blood thirsty deputies) actually only did what he considered necessary to hang on to power and keep his country stable. Compared to you and I who really know little compared to their expertise, it seems a logical point, and to be fair looking at the increasingly fragmented and violent situation in Iraq now, one has to say there is merit to their argument (although I dont have the knowledge or expertise to push the point any further than that).

 

On the other hand, we've spread freedom and democracy to another (unwilling recipient) in the world and secured their oil supply, so alls well that ends well I suppose.

 

........and on to the next bogeyman Iran, and already Venezuela seems to be queued up for the invasion after that.

 

By the way, its a fairly well know historical fact that through history empires have crumbled when they've tried to expand their ethos and empire throughout the world quickly...................who's gonna be next to rule the world, China? Lord help us! Where did I put my fishing rod, its time to go and forget about all that :)

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Yoxer, you clearly disagree with the reasons for going to war, which I fully respect.

 

Actually - all yoxer had done is learned the art of copy and paste. :rolleyes:

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My final point Yox - if it wasn't for the stupidty of 25 million allied soldiers between 1937 and 1945 we'd all be under the rule of Adolf Hitler or his direct descendents (I am including UK, US and Russian forces in that).

 

It is complete bullsh1t to say that doing military service and putting your life on the line is stupidity.....

 

I'd bet you'd not be as keen to publish that view in a national newspaper with your address supplied.


Ian W

 

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I wonder what the majority of soldiers that were involved in those wars would have to say regarding the stupidy of it now, and as you well know , or should do , compairing the 1st & 2nd world wars to the farce of the gulf war is a dumb comparison in which the only common denominator is that one hell of a lot of people have and will continue to die , and for what ?????? greed and stupidity ? Yeah thats real sensible and noble cause to die for and inflict suffering on millions

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oohhhhhh and not lets forget just how much the worlds a safer place now

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perhaps youd also care to explain why it wasnt ok for hitler to invade other countries yet appears acceptable for us to ?

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Actually - all yoxer had done is learned the art of copy and paste. :rolleyes:

Thats Yoxer for you , the copy and paste Sh*t stirrer. :clap:

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