PAC FURY OVER NUDD'S CALL FOR PIKE CULL

[gozzer]

I understand what you are saying Leon, and if we had 'natural' waters then yes, nature would maintain a balance. But we don't have many 'natural' waters. Every water that is fished regularly is effected, either by an unnatural amount of feed being introduced, by restocking to 'create' a 'fishery' and fish deaths or injury through bad handling or deep hooking etc. The point that I'm trying to make is that, although we like to think of waters as being natural, we create fisheries to suit our (you could say) selfish needs. I realise that a cull of small pike would have to be an 'ongoing' thing. On the water I mentioned, it was carried out for about six years, and would have been longer if circumstances had not changed. As I said I would like to go back and see what had happened in the intervening years.

Angling today is like the society we live in, everything has to be instant. So fisheries are created to suit that need. It's a strange fact that if a water is producing through a mass stocking programme, to create an 'instant' fix, very few complain. But someone mentions "culling" a small number of fish to give the same 'instant' fix, then there is an outcry, and the 'hang him high' brigade are on the march!

[Leon Roskilly]

But someone mentions "culling" a small number of fish to give the same 'instant' fix, then there is an outcry, and the 'hang him high' brigade are on the march!

 

 

I think that the problem is that where there appears to be some decent pike fishing available, someone wants to ruin it because it doesn't suit their own approach to fishing.

 

The fact that they obviously have no idea of the implications of what they are suggesting just hands further ammunition to those who would prefer to have their pike fishing left as it is.

[gozzer]

I think that the problem is that where there appears to be some decent pike fishing available, someone wants to ruin it because it doesn't suit their own approach to fishing.

 

The fact that they obviously have no idea of the implications of what they are suggesting just hands further ammunition to those who would prefer to have their pike fishing left as it is.

 

I'm not saying that I necessary agree with what Bob Nudd has said. I am just trying to point out the hypocrisy that is in angling. I know of several waters that have been 'ruined' by the stocking of large numbers of a species that were not previously present, or were there in small numbers. Introducing catfish and zander were not to everyone's taste, but were done by either the people who run the water or illegally by individuals that wanted to create a fishery to suit there own preferences. Carp (my own particular grievance) are stocked to suit some people but certainly not mine. These didn't create the uproar that seems to surround the pike issue. In this case it's a matchman talking about pike, and the old arguments and rivalry comes to the surface again.

When you talk about a balance of pike in a water, does it mean just pike or any predator? In the river where we tried it, it brought about an increase in the size of pike as well as perch and chub. So the predator/prey balance was maintained, in weight for weight terms.

 

I am in no way anti pike, and believe that a healthy water needs predators, not just ones with fins either.

But the outcry over one mans thoughts on taking small pike out of a couple of fisheries, IMO speaks more for the divide between the different branches of angling than it does for the welfare of the fish.

[Steve Walker]

Total incomprehension between different camps of anglers is nothing new. A club I used to be a member of had a number of good carp in its water. The committee, which was (as is usually the case) dominated by match anglers, wanted to have the large carp netted and swapped for large numbers of pasties. They had a "good" offer from a fish dealer for this service. The club's carp anglers were, understandably, not too keen on the idea. The committee members just couldn't get their heads around why the carp anglers would object to stocking more carp.

[Grandma]

I am in no way anti pike, and believe that a healthy water needs predators, not just ones with fins either.

But the outcry over one mans thoughts on taking small pike out of a couple of fisheries, IMO speaks more for the divide between the different branches of angling than it does for the welfare of the fish.

 

Where did you get 'taking a few small pike out of a couple of fisheries' from?

 

An article appeared in a national 'News' paper stating that 'there are too many pike in our rivers and they need culling'. Three major waterways were named as examples.

 

Hence the outcry.

Edited October 20, 2006 by Grandma

[Grandma]

I agree with you about carp BTW, there was evidence of carp breeding succesfully this year on a Fenland waterway.

[Dick Dastardly]

As usual people seem to be either commenting on something without bothering to get the facts (in this case not reading the actual article in the NoTW or on Bobs own web site to which I supplied a link) or of course just choosing to ignore the facts.

 

Bob B,I dont give a damn if Bob Nudd has ever personaly killed a pike or not.It is the many that could be killed by people following his "advice" that worries me.

 

Rabbit (good to see you posting again BTW) Many match anglers do target the bigger fish (such as the barbel you mention) in matchs.In fact on some stretchs of the Severn Barbel are the main target species.

 

I dont think this is (or should be) a pike anglers versus match anglers style debate.

 

Bob Nudds the only person Ive seen at the moment calling for a cull?

 

Im not that sure that he really thinks ones required any way,just a daft ill thought comment after a bad match.Shame he hasnt got either the guts or sense to retract it or understand what a daft thing he has done.Ive really got no problem with him but noise has got to be made otherwise we will see a return to the days of all jacks/pike being slung up the bank by match anglers/match angling orientated clubs etc.

 

The PAC came into being to stop this sort of thing and they have been directly responsible for the improvment in the situation.Be a great shame for all that hard work to be undone by one missguided article in a shite rag like the News of the Screws!

[gozzer]

Sorry Budgie but I've got to disagree about the 'debate' over Bob Nudds statement. If you look on here, MD, P&P, Total fishing etc, you will see the 'how many fish die in keepnets' posts. This is a match versus pike angler issue. It has been boiling for a long time and now the ill conceived words of a top matchman has lifted the lid. For many years the match fraternity had the upper hand within angling, mainly because it was the only way to get to distant waters cheaply, from large industrial towns. The large associations in places like Birmingham, Sheffield, Leeds etc, leased waters and catered mainly for matches. It was always a beef with me and Leeds and district ASA, that there were not enough waters laid by for 'pleasure' anglers. Later the various specimen groups were formed (and if I remember correctly, some of those didn't get on). Then the commercials took members away from the associations, and the power started to change. The conflict has escalated from there. It is never going to change until we all realise that we have to share the waters between the various factions of angling. The belief that their own chosen branch of angling is somehow superior to that of another, that is so prevalent in many posts on here and other forums, has got to go. I don't know how this can be achieved, maybe a common enemy attacking angling will be the catalyst, but judging by the 'knee jerk' comments I've read so far, I doubt it.

[smudger]

Sorry Budgie but I've got to disagree about the 'debate' over Bob Nudds statement. If you look on here, MD, P&P, Total fishing etc, you will see the 'how many fish die in keepnets' posts. This is a match versus pike angler issue. It has been boiling for a long time and now the ill conceived words of a top matchman has lifted the lid. For many years the match fraternity had the upper hand within angling, mainly because it was the only way to get to distant waters cheaply, from large industrial towns. The large associations in places like Birmingham, Sheffield, Leeds etc, leased waters and catered mainly for matches. It was always a beef with me and Leeds and district ASA, that there were not enough waters laid by for 'pleasure' anglers. Later the various specimen groups were formed (and if I remember correctly, some of those didn't get on). Then the commercials took members away from the associations, and the power started to change. The conflict has escalated from there. It is never going to change until we all realise that we have to share the waters between the various factions of angling. The belief that their own chosen branch of angling is somehow superior to that of another, that is so prevalent in many posts on here and other forums, has got to go. I don't know how this can be achieved, maybe a common enemy attacking angling will be the catalyst, but judging by the 'knee jerk' comments I've read so far, I doubt it.

 

Was it not a "knee jerk" comment that started this debate/argument off in the first place! The conflict will never stop until the match fraternity realize's that having pike in any given water is essential for having

a good head of silver fish.And to stop trying to have there own way all of the time!!

[Bob Bradford]

A very poor analagy Peter more like-

 

Dear Mr Nudd,In return for you not killing any more pike (to prevent an explosion of small jacks) I will refrain from killing anymore roach to use as pens for writing letters........

 

Both make just as much sense to me!

 

I keep saying its not the fact that a pikes being killed that concerns me it is the reasoning behind it.

 

Budgie both you and Peter Waller have stated on here that Bob Nudd kills Pike...and that is simply not true, if it were perhaps you or Peter would like to inform me just how many? print it on here for all to see please.

As for the rest of match angling blindly following his alleged comments....well frankly, it is both insulting and stupid....Nigel Williams was caught red-handed illegally transporting live fish into Ireland does it follow that the majority of Pike anglers will follow his example? of course not and to suggest such a thing is equally insulting and stupid to Pike anglers.

 

Bob Nudd has been badly represented in a National newspaper ,ironically by an ex- match angler would you believe? My information is Bob was talking on the phone to this journo and his words have been mis-represented, I have suffered the same from my local angling journo several times when interviewed over the phone, as Keith Arthur said only this morning on Fisherman's Blues to Mark Barrett, "When it comes to using quotes Bob should have written it himself and not relied on some-one else" THAT is what Bob Nudd is guilty of...trusting in another person, I doubt he will make the same mistake twice, let me assure you and anyone else that has an interest, match anglers will not go on a pike killing spree because of this, there are too many of us that are repulsed by this sort of thing and would never condone such actions,regards Bob.