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On 1/23/2021 at 8:36 PM, BoldBear said:

I can’t talk for Tigger, but I occasionally chase shoals of Rudd along the surface using floating Caster on the estate lake. I keep them feeding on the surface by catapulting some floating casters over them, and I use a ‘semi loaded’ onion waggler with the float set at around 18” away from the the hook with no shot between the float and hook; which allows me to easily cast way past the feeding shoal then wind slowly back amongst the Surface feeding Rudd. I sometimes use a floating Caster and a sinking Caster together which usually floats just under the surface, or I just use a single floating Caster on the hook which I have left out in the air to dry out a bit.

And when I’m using a smallish floating crust for Chub (or Carp) on a stream or small river I just freeline it downstream, or I sometimes stop it from drifting too far downstream by laying my line over some streamer weed or other weed lying on the surface. and I usually use a 12ft or 13ft specialist rod.

Ive only used this method in the warmer months, and I use it when there has been signs of Chub picking off food as it drifts past them in the current; or for Rudd; drifting in the surface tow; and they’ve also had a nibble at a floating bait that I’ve catapulted or thrown out near them or drifted past them in the current.

Keith

Thanks BB. Very helpful. Just one small question. For the rudd, why do you use a semi-loaded waggler rather than a fully loaded as you have no other weight on the line?

john clarke

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On 1/24/2021 at 12:44 AM, Tigger said:

 

When using floating bread on the river I usually freeline it, and because I mostly use floating bread on small rivers distance isn't an issue.  Although you can get a piece of crust a fair distance by giving it a quick dunk in the water and then underarming it out.

Very often I freeling bread on stillwaters also.  On still waters I very often fish bread on a running leger set up, this allows the bread to float to the surface so long as enough line is released to allow it to pop up.  Once popped up you can tighten up and even wind down to varying levels in the water column or even wind right down to bottom if need be.

This method also keeps your bread from drifting.

When using floating casters I often use a drennan puddle chucker float which is pre weighted and you can change the weights to suite.  I use no weight on the line and if I can't see my caster I have to rely on the float, although a wind or two of the reel can move the caster enough to get it back into focus.  Another thing I do is attatch a piece of peacock quill or a waggler of the desired length via a rubber top and bottom and add a weight either side so the quill lies flat on the surface.  The peacock quill is good as it stands out being white. 

Thanks Tigger, I've made a note of both your and BB's comments for the summer - something to look forward to!

I believe the approach you use with carp with a running ledger on the bottom and the bread coming up vertically is called a 'zig rig'. I tried it once and found it hard to get the line flowing freely enough through the ledger ring, but will try it again.

A question re puddle chucker floats. I must get some. But are you saying that a float comes with different weights? Surely, only one weight will give the right setting in the water unless the extra weights have their own attached buoyancy?

john clarke

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On 1/25/2021 at 3:07 PM, The Flying Tench said:

Thanks BB. Very helpful. Just one small question. For the rudd, why do you use a semi-loaded waggler rather than a fully loaded as you have no other weight on the line?

I never use fully loaded wagglers as they are not sensitive enough for me, and fully loaded floats not only cause some disturbance as they land but they also tend to sink a bit on landing; whereas an onion float is only partially loaded and doesn’t cause that much disturbance when it lands.

Also the Onion float flies through the air as straight as a die and without the characteristic waggle which gives the waggler it’s name, and makes accurate casting a doddle, and it can easily be cast further than you can catapult your maggots or caster which is all you really need, plus an onion float is quite a sensitive float, and it usually has an insert tip, or has a fine stem, or is tapered. 

NB: Being only partially loaded; If you didn't use any shot at its base at all then the onion float would lie almost flat on the surface, although I prefer mine to cock so it is still visible at a distance and I can see it rising or sinking or moving sideways whenever a Rudd takes the bait.

The onion float has a small copper tube at its base as it’s loading (see pic)

Onion.gif

.—-

Like Tigger; When I’m surface fishing for Carp; and I need to prevent my bait from drifting into adjacent swims; I occasionally use a suspended crust (or Anchored Crust) too.

Sunken-Surface-Bait.gif

It’s been called it a ‘Suspended crust’ or an ‘Anchored crust’ for as long as I can remember, and a long long time before anglers started to refer to it as a ‘Zig Rig’. I could be wrong but I think the Zig Rig was named after ‘Zig’  (zyg Gregorek) who started the ‘Anglers Paradise’ holiday site in the West Country, but as I said I may be wrong, but the Zig Rig name certainly came about in the days when Zig first opened his Anglers Paradise holiday enterprise.

I find it best when there is a slight ripple on the surface and I often find it even better when I use my crust submerged just under the surface film. It’s also very useful when there are water fowl nearby as a couple of turns of the reel handle will sink it out of sight until the waterfowl has passed.

Keith

 

 

Edited by BoldBear

Happiness is Fish shaped (it used to be woman shaped but the wife is getting on a bit now)

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I just bung a small float on and fix it both ends ,no weights and suspend the hook 6-10 inches below it ,the float isnt being used to show bites merely to suspend the bait from point x ,i use a closed face and let the line come out over my finger ,if it suddenly changes  in speed or stops i strike .

The river is to fast and swirly for even fat bodied floats your striking every second or so the damned thing hits the streamer weed or sunken twigs etc .with the method i use lifting your finger works like slowing a centerpin and the bait rises .

The only problem is trout they can actually cut your finger if your not careful the buggers just love bread and hit it hard and run!

Its pretty crude and even works in lakes for fishing just under the surface ,in this case the float is the weight needed to flick the bait over lillies etc ,the float will just lie on its side with the bait under it ,in this case you will see ripples coming off it as the fish are nibbling the bread then rise and disapear when the fish takes the bait proper but even before that you can hook the timid ones by striking earlier.

Weights can be anything even things that float

One angler i watched down the pond was catching on realy crude tackle and on a hot day when bites were not coming ,he had a small polystyrene ball with a wire feeder forced into it (end on) with a hole through the ball for the line to go through

He suspended the hook 6" under it using one of those old carp stops stuffed the cage with ground bait and stuck a maggot on the hook and chucked it in.

The thing bobbed away with the groundbait obviously slowly coming out and had some really nice rudd on it ,they just towed it away or changed its direction etc

Edited by chesters1
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Believe NOTHING anyones says or writes unless you witness it yourself and even then your eyes can deceive you

None of this "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" crap it just means i have at least two enemies!

 

There is only one opinion i listen to ,its mine and its ALWAYS right even when its wrong

 

Its far easier to curse the darkness than light one candle

 

Mathew 4:19

Grangers law : anything i say will  turn out the opposite or not happen at all!

Life insurance? you wont enjoy a penny!

"To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical." Thomas Jefferson

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8 hours ago, The Flying Tench said:

Thanks Tigger, I've made a note of both your and BB's comments for the summer - something to look forward to!

I believe the approach you use with carp with a running ledger on the bottom and the bread coming up vertically is called a 'zig rig'. I tried it once and found it hard to get the line flowing freely enough through the ledger ring, but will try it again.

A question re puddle chucker floats. I must get some. But are you saying that a float comes with different weights? Surely, only one weight will give the right setting in the water unless the extra weights have their own attached buoyancy?

 

Yes, your right the puddle chucker floats do only come with one weight.  The weight just pushes into the bottom of the float and cocks it, but, the float can usually take more weightto sink the tip to the desired amount showing. If you have a few various sizes of the float you can change the weights.  Failing that you can just add shot directly under the float.

You can use the loaded drennan wagglers which have the same set up as the puddle chuckers, the reason I mentioned the puddle chuckers is because they are short in the body and don't sink the line so much.

You could use a genuine surface fishing float like the carp ones, the ones wheee your line is attatched to the top of the float which doesn't sink it, if you get my meaning.

I'm not sure if those floats are called controller floats.

Edited by Tigger
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ALL,

Strange we will talk about the same setup - one side of the penny will use a "zig rig" or modifications. The other side of the penny we use terms like "puffs" for a "pickup".

Long before ex-pats brought the term zig-rig to the states a multitude of modifications for this rig allows an angler to fish "from the bottom up".

My most successful use was a  "secret" for perhaps 2 or 3 years.  HERE you go - the rig reveled. TABLE ROCK lake is 110 - 125 ft deep at the dam. I used a 3 - 4 oz pyramid weight to tag the bottom. Because this lake has an almost impenetrable thermocline  I float fished right under the barrier. To determine the location I simply plumbed with a 12ish inch long 5 or 6 ounce stick.  At this point size and weight of the bait were calculated. Lighten the stick weight until it no longer surfaced. The target fish were carp and buffalo and the thermocline was a natural feeder as particles took on enough water to sink. These were enormous fish and rarely caught one under 30lb. Down side lost a lot of line but it would always float to the surface. Pyramid wt were $1 ea too.

I don't care what anyone says, if you are catching one specimen fish after another (with others looking on) it's a great feeling

Phone

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