T Rump and history

[chesters1]

All,

 

Again, this is a difficult topic. Hugh, for example bases his comment partly on "it is to a man who was a well liked and respected leader of men". That's only true in the South Hugh. In the North he is remembered as a brilliant and ruthless traitor; who treated his slaves horribly and lots of other horsechit. Fact is, the statues were not placed to either praise or vilify Lee (or any of a thousand other statues of Civil War "heroes". The were, as I said earlier, erected to intimidate minorities by White Southerners who refused and still refuse slaves are not property.

 

May I add, for Chesters1, the winners get to write the history. The Colonies won!! (now if I could only figure out what it is we "won")

 

Phone

You won the right not to look at our history but make the same mistakes we did ,simply if you dont exterminate inhabitants of countries you invade they come back to bite you

[Huge_Vitae]

All,

 

Again, this is a difficult topic. Hugh, for example bases his comment partly on "it is to a man who was a well liked and respected leader of men". That's only true in the South Hugh. In the North he is remembered as a brilliant and ruthless traitor; who treated his slaves horribly and lots of other horsechit. Fact is, the statues were not placed to either praise or vilify Lee (or any of a thousand other statues of Civil War "heroes". The were, as I said earlier, erected to intimidate minorities by White Southerners who refused and still refuse slaves are not property.

 

May I add, for Chesters1, the winners get to write the history. The Colonies won!! (now if I could only figure out what it is we "won")

 

Phone

Not quite Phone, your editing removed a pertinent factor in my statement. But I stand by it even in it's, now different context, because I don't do Political History and care not for his personal traits other than in a Military Concept.

 

But to carry on as I was saying, where do you draw a line? Perhaps we should be looking at all those statues of old boney!

 

Just seems to me, as somebody else said to me earlier, "Oh yes, The United States of America, probably the only country in the World stupid and dumb enough to start a civil war over the same arguments that caused their last one!"

[Phone]

Hugh,

 

I believe you are spot on with your last comment.

 

Problem is - the "war" by Southern standards IS NOT OVER - just half-time. In effect, the intervening years from 1864 until present has simply been a "cold war".

 

As for destroying any material symbol of any prior event in history is wrong - world wide. ISIS destroyed antiquity a few months ago to make a political statement. Broke my heart.

 

Phone

[Huge_Vitae]

Spent a few moments looking at Civil War statues in general, some interesting ones there.

 

Just a quick point without knowing when those that now cause offence were originally erected, why is it in the last week or so that they are being torn down, surely it should of happend in the eight years of the last administration, or, is it only recently that the hatred accumulated over the last what, 153 years, has reached breaking point?

[chesters1]

Spent a few moments looking at Civil War statues in general, some interesting ones there.

 

Just a quick point without knowing when those that now cause offence were originally erected, why is it in the last week or so that they are being torn down, surely it should of happend in the eight years of the last administration, or, is it only recently that the hatred accumulated over the last what, 153 years, has reached breaking point?

Yankee trouble makers ,those in the south should rise up and put them in their place before the confederate states cease to exist

That ole land of the free ,well to have a freedom to display historical reality ...not

Its time you stood up to the north keeping you under its thumb .fiiiiiight!

 

First your flags ,now your statues what next not having the option of your sister being your mother ,stand up for your rights

Edited August 22, 2017 by chesters1

[Huge_Vitae]

When replying to phone I made reference to the Numerous statues f Napoleon Bonaparte and was going to end with 'whatever next, Nelson's Column?'

 

Oh well.........

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/aug/22/toppling-statues-nelsons-column-should-be-next-slavery

[chesters1]

When replying to phone I made reference to the Numerous statues f Napoleon Bonaparte and was going to end with 'whatever next, Nelson's Column?'

 

Oh well.........

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/aug/22/toppling-statues-nelsons-column-should-be-next-slavery

Look out cecil rhodes and his opinion on the "anglo-saxon" race lol

[Phone]

All, (Hugh)

 

I will try without expressing my personal opinion to offer an impossible explanation.

 

With the end of the Obama administration and the election of Trump racism has become extremely polarized (again). Mr Trump has a penchant for chaos on a world order that only he can rectify. He is a white superiority "nationalist". Other examples of his political persuasion that come to mind - Immigration, North Korea, a trade war with China and the efficiency of servitude slavery . Among America's elected leaders, only President Trump saw a nobility of purpose in the "counter protests" by white bigots hoisting torches symbolic of our KKK, reviving old Nazi chants, all reinforced from the "bully pulpit". The message is clear, the fate of WHITE America, the only one that counts is NOW at stake. In American history we think of folks like George Wallace or segregationist Dixiecrat Strom Thurmond. White militia openly carry weapons to "protect" America while angrily screaming vile and racist slogans.

 

It is impossible for me to explain the race issue in America to a foreign guest. Most of our differences are exaggerated, fueled by uncompromising ignorance. Fewer that 10% of Americans read a daily newspaper. The Civil War is not over. There were actually multiple "causes" for the Civil War which were mostly settled by 1865 But not slavery.

 

While contemplating the fate of Confederate statues in both the North and the South - 323 people were shot to death in Chicago - 90% black.

 

Phone

[Sportsman]

That was a very powerful post Phone.

Good to hear from someone who lives in the States and knows what he is talking about.

Thanks

[Steve Walker]

When replying to phone I made reference to the Numerous statues f Napoleon Bonaparte and was going to end with 'whatever next, Nelson's Column?'

 

Oh well.........

 

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/aug/22/toppling-statues-nelsons-column-should-be-next-slavery

My eyes hurt from rolling.