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Just re read your post and it still comes across that you are "talking down to us" this being an example-

 

"I give to you that IF Otters didn't look like the cuddly toys that most of the members of AN had as a child (or perhaps they still have listening to their childish retorts ) than the Otter would just be another victim,"

Woah dudes!

I don't see/ read any attacks in redfins posting....though it does seem it can be read several ways I don't read an attack on any members here in it...just a confirmation of my statement on PR.

Take a chill pill

It's a forum, we read things differently and sometimes grab the wrong end of the stick by doing so.

Redfin, I confess to not understanding who the end is aimed at though, the teddy throwing bit....I don't perceive anyone throwing rattles or teddies during this discussion as of yet....in fact it's been well thought out and pleasant.

Edited by kirisute

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It's a forum, we read things differently and sometimes grab the wrong end of the stick by doing so.

 

 

Yes I certainly may have but if so then Redfin could have simply pointed that out and explained it in a way I could have understood surely................................or is he not that worried how people interpret his posts?

 

Its not just this topic though Kirisute.


And thats my "non indicative opinion"!

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Yes I certainly may have but if so then Redfin could have simply pointed that out and explained it in a way I could have understood surely................................or is he not that worried how people interpret his posts?

 

Its not just this topic though Kirisute.

As you say....I don't read/post enough or keep track of events.....I had one run in with someone on here when I first joined and that's about it on the " people who annoy other people" scale! Lol!

I say as I see...so I posted what I posted....

Forums are a minefield...in a pub you see people's faces, judge their looks, read them and understand where they are coming from far easier...

Here all we have are words and meanings get cocked up and crossed over etc

So far I thought this thread was really good natured..but if I knew more then maybe I'd read it differently to

Edited by kirisute

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Guest redfin2
Woah dudes!

I don't see/ read any attacks in redfins posting....though it does seem it can be read several ways I don't read an attack on any members here in it...just a confirmation of my statement on PR.

Take a chill pill

It's a forum, we read things differently and sometimes grab the wrong end of the stick by doing so.

Redfin, I confess to not understanding who the end is aimed at though, the teddy throwing bit....I don't perceive anyone throwing rattles or teddies during this discussion as of yet....in fact it's been well thought out and pleasant.

 

Hi kirsuite,

Thanks for standing up and giving some support in what I am saying, it was from the heart, I actually as I have said embrace all wildlife , including Otters, however what get's me is all this nonsense with if it ain't cute it's horrible, that is brought about by the culture we live in. I love nature warts and all, and to me if a tremendous bias is offered to any species that will be to the detriment of other wildlife, and if fish are the victims then of course that is acceptable to a large percentage of the population, but that it should be to Anglers, and on here , well that is pretty remarkable.

 

Of course Otters have impacted on fish stocks, and yes Barbel being the main victims....at the moment. Martin Bowler is a regular or was on a stretch of the Bristol Avon , I have a friend that fished with him there just last season and previous seasons, this season however the Barbel have virtually all gone...but the Otter population has flourished, fact.

 

As Anglers should we be concerned?..you bet.

However I am not of the opinion that Otters should be blamed, for they are doing what Otters do, but what I will say is that the attitude of those that disregard that fish are essential to for our waterways and also our leisure pursuit should be made aware that we as Anglers have a right to protect what we love doing.

 

Dales posted that to him he would rather watch an Otter than catch fish, well I don't know about that, but I do know that once the rivers have been stripped of fish then the Otter itself will be the victim in all this.

 

What I find incredulous is the wave of love for the Otter and to hell with anything else, and those that voice any sort of concern are branded as vermin.

 

I really think that it is too late to do anything, certainly hunting the Otter or culling would be bad PR, perhaps there is actually no problem and the decreased catches is merely a cycle, and the likes of Bowler and co: are wrong and we can all keep calm carry on.

 

Anglers and Angling have always been a soft touch, hardly surprising when we can't show a united front when we are being deprived of our beautiful past time.

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Guest redfin2
Yes I certainly may have but if so then Redfin could have simply pointed that out and explained it in a way I could have understood surely................................or is he not that worried how people interpret his posts?

 

Its not just this topic though Kirisute.

 

Oh come off it Budgie, all of a sudden you are so sensitive? Please point out where I have been abusive?

 

 

Blowing smoke up each others backsides and agreeing on everything would be an odd forum I reckon, however that is what we have it seems.

 

Oh well :rolleyes:

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Just re read your post and it still comes across that you are "talking down to us" this being an example-

 

"I give to you that IF Otters didn't look like the cuddly toys that most of the members of AN had as a child (or perhaps they still have listening to their childish retorts ) than the Otter would just be another victim,"

 

 

Not being "sensitive" and never said your post was offensive (maybe your turn to re read?), just still cant really work out where you stand to be honest but it must be me being thick! I tend to find this with a lot of your posts?


And thats my "non indicative opinion"!

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Guest redfin2

just still cant really work out where you stand to be honest

* Read this :)

 

Hi kirsuite,

Thanks for standing up and giving some support in what I am saying, it was from the heart, I actually as I have said embrace all wildlife , including Otters, however what get's me is all this nonsense with if it ain't cute it's horrible, that is brought about by the culture we live in. I love nature warts and all, and to me if a tremendous bias is offered to any species that will be to the detriment of other wildlife, and if fish are the victims then of course that is acceptable to a large percentage of the population, but that it should be to Anglers, and on here , well that is pretty remarkable.

 

Of course Otters have impacted on fish stocks, and yes Barbel being the main victims....at the moment. Martin Bowler is a regular or was on a stretch of the Bristol Avon , I have a friend that fished with him there just last season and previous seasons, this season however the Barbel have virtually all gone...but the Otter population has flourished, fact.

 

As Anglers should we be concerned?..you bet.

However I am not of the opinion that Otters should be blamed, for they are doing what Otters do, but what I will say is that the attitude of those that disregard that fish are essential to for our waterways and also our leisure pursuit should be made aware that we as Anglers have a right to protect what we love doing.

 

Dales posted that to him he would rather watch an Otter than catch fish, well I don't know about that, but I do know that once the rivers have been stripped of fish then the Otter itself will be the victim in all this.

 

What I find incredulous is the wave of love for the Otter and to hell with anything else, and those that voice any sort of concern are branded as vermin.

 

I really think that it is too late to do anything, certainly hunting the Otter or culling would be bad PR, perhaps there is actually no problem and the decreased catches is merely a cycle, and the likes of Bowler and co: are wrong and we can all keep calm carry on.

 

Anglers and Angling have always been a soft touch, hardly surprising when we can't show a united front when we are being deprived of our beautiful past time.

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I didn't give any support to what you said.... I suggested budgie might have the wrong end of the stick and tried to defuse a possible thread breaking argument. Don't recall writing anywhere about supporting what you said......

Your second post is divided as is the whole argument...in one point you are amazed that an angler can put the sight of an otter over the loss of fish....at another point your suggesting otters are to blame.....then you state you don't believe they should be....

That's a confusing post and a possible reason to mis read it! Lol!

Your argument is as justified as is anyone else's...right or wrong all we can do is voice our opinions...

 

We are putting back a natural predator into an Eco system that is no longer provided with natural prey as it was when the predator was prevalent naturally. The time period of its return to that Eco system will involve the Eco system changing to suit the new predator; natural balance will occur at a given point. The issue is nature will not be left alone to obtain a natural balance....us humans have ****ed all that up! Both in the first place and during the re introduction.

Nature will not be left alone without our influence, but by giving our influence we are in fact effecting nature!

Natural process involves complete loss of species, devastation of Eco systems, wiping out of habitat and other disasters the like of which most naturalists find abhorrent....so we interfere.

Bowler says what he sees in his experience. I say what I see in mine. You say what you see in yours. None of it is right, or wrong.....right, is what this place was before humans came along! when we came along we screwed it up for good! The best we can now achieve is a constant battle to produce an estimated guess at what nature would be if we didn't screw it all up in the first place!

Edited by kirisute

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Blowing smoke up each others backsides and agreeing on everything would be an odd forum I reckon, however that is what we have it seems.

 

Obviously not else we would all be blowing smoke up your back side and agreeing with you! Shame you have to revert back to that "your all in a clique" rubbish just because some one questions you and does not blindly agree.So many seem to be doing that recently.

 

There has never been a "them and us" thing on here.

 

But as I keep saying I simply dont know if I agree with you or disagree as I just cant work out what your saying to do so!


And thats my "non indicative opinion"!

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Kiris,

 

If there is a way to use rather than defuse "thread breaking banter" to stop this crap pm me would you?

 

I'm really sick of otter BS. This is at least the 11th time (728 posts) this has been "round the block" since Nov. 1st. Geeez-us!!!!!

 

Phone

Still - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -- - - - - - - - I seem to read it and reply. (?) It's like talking about using a bow and arrow in this country. Never ending.

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