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So that lets angling out then as it presumably a watersport.

 

It may be the way you do it Peter :)

Let's agree to respect each others views, no matter how wrong yours may be.

 

 

Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity

 

 

 

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Lets be realistic here. The majority of the general public don't associate angling with "bloodsports" and have no wish to see angling banned. For anglers to back the Countryside Alliance will put us in the same corner, and that is where the only danger will stem from.

 

 

Eat right, stay fit, die anyway.

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Whatever happened to the good old Country Sports

 

Im am against the ban and think all forms of hunting except those that are bad for fishing should be allowed (such as bow hunting)

Whatever floats your boat...

See how I float mine, here

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Lots of predictably boring replies, including this one, added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 19:54 GMT 19:54 UK:

 

"When they ban fishing then perhaps the fox hunting will stop. Arrogant left wing nonsense based on no facts whatsoever. If there is no hunting in the city then let those city dwellers just go back there and live.

John Wilson, Norwich"

Surely not?

 

Have a care Paul, that you don't slip into the predictable and boring groove yourself.....Oh my God its too late......he's gone.

 

Here are the predictable but not so boring responses as they came from that poll. Not selected and not ignoring the bad news (the antis) and not pushing the good news (the sensible folk) . Read on and ponder whether this farce of a piece of legislation, this fiddling whilst the NHS and law and order burn won't come back and haunt Emperor Blair. Of course it wont. Wonderboy is wobbling as we speak. Must rush, got to polish my stirrup cup for the morning. huuurrraaahhhh

 

Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 21:10 GMT 21:10 UK

 

It's a stupid law! Hunting is part of our heritage and tradition. My grand-fathers fought in the wars for freedom they would turn in their graves to see what has become of the country they fought for.

 

Lorraine Shaw, Caddo Mills Texas

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 21:10 GMT 21:10 UK

 

The hunting law was a waste of public money,but the so called MP'S, do gooder's and anti's are good at that.I have never been on a hunt myself its not my scene,but whatever happened to freedom of choice.All the problem's this country has, and that lot above pick on a way of life (god help us).

brian.

 

brian, halifax

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 21:10 GMT 21:10 UK

 

I have never hunted in my life nor ever likely to, and I don't live in the countryside, but I think that the "ban" on hunting is wrong and ridiculous. I hope that more hunts defy the law or find loopholes, and continue to hunt successfully and campaign against such a pointless and stupid law.

 

Clare, Weybridge

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 21:10 GMT 21:10 UK

 

I'm personally on the fence on this issue. I hate unwanted state influence it to peoples lives, however I do think that this "sport" may well be a barbaric practice. The real issue now, though, is that poorly drafted legislation means that this is not a total ban. All that has been banned is using the dog to kill the fox, as we can see it is still lawful to kill with a bird of prey or a gun etc. If something is going to be illegal then make it illegal not in a legal hinterland!

 

Alex, Gloucester

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 21:09 GMT 21:09 UK

 

To Roger of wiltshire:

This government was re-elected by something like 24% of the WHOLE electorate - not a mandate to do anything at all I would say, never mind banning anything they don't like.

 

Gordon Burgess-Parker, Foxt, Staffordshire, United Kingdom

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 21:04 GMT 21:04 UK

 

This 'ban' on hunting is like so much of the legislation passed by this and the preceeding govenment. Badly written and ill thought out , with so many loopholes any half decent lawyer can drive a coach and horses through it. Or did the Government realise that a ban on foxhunting would rebound in the ballot box? Cynical, thats me!

 

Barry P, Havant England

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 21:03 GMT 21:03 UK

 

As much as i disagree with Parliaments proceedings building upto the ban on fox hunting using dogs, i am in strong belief that the majority of this population (stats show around 60%) are still stuck in the traditional world. wake up. we;re in the 21st century. Fox hunting is not, in my eyes, a "sport". a sport should give both (or all) parties the opportunity to win, and the other to loose. how does anyone expect a rabbit to "win" the "sport" against 100 blood thirsty hounds?

 

Jaime, Leicester

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 21:02 GMT 21:02 UK

 

I don't hunt, but absolutely acknowledge the right of people to continue a tradition with hundreds of years of history. I look forward to the day, which will inevitably come, when this ridiculous law, driven through as a sop to PC liberals, is reversed (and I speak as a lawyer).

 

Mike

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 21:01 GMT 21:01 UK

 

I think it is fantastic that the hunts have been out in force today. It won't be long until people recognise the valuable service these people are doing in rallying against the crazy and banal legislation that is permeating all parts of our daily lives thanks to the current government. Rock on!

 

William Beresford, London

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 21:00 GMT 21:00 UK

 

Domestic cats hunt and kill 300 million wild animals a year, I don't see the govenerment banning people from owning cats. So why then should they ban people from owning dogs to hunt foxes. This law is a complete waste of time, it has a political agenda which unfortunately is the only thing that matters to governments nowadays!

 

Chris, Cumbria

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 20:59 GMT 20:59 UK

 

Up the hunt! Its a part of our rapidly dying culture and tradition. It should NOT become one of the many things that are ludicrously banned. Ask a few poultry farmers how they feel about foxes.

 

Nathan, Dewsbury

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 20:58 GMT 20:58 UK

 

Banning hunting will only result in more suffering for foxes when farmers, who are only trying to protect their livestock, shoot without killing the fox cleanly. The fox will then go off and have a slow, painful death in the woods. In the same way that us country folk don't interfere in the lives of people in the cities, city-dwellers should not tell us how to manage our land. This is political correctness gone mad...

 

Benjamin, Yorkshire

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 20:55 GMT 20:55 UK

 

The hunts are laughing at the Government, which is ineptly trying to ignore the whole affair and keep everybody happy. If it mattered enough to pass a law - and enough people voted Labour to suggest that that is what the majority want - the Government should enforce that law. Otherwise people will simply pick and choose which laws they think should not apply to them, such as already happens with the laws on speeding and drink driving.

 

Roger, Wiltshire

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 20:51 GMT 20:51 UK

 

Surely now that huntiing has been banned the 'Hunting season' no longer exists!

 

Phil, Rural Oxfordshire

 

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Added: Saturday, 5 November, 2005, 20:50 GMT 20:50 UK

 

From an ex resident of Engalnd, God Bless the USA. Hunting is recognised as part of effective game management as well as part of our heritage. You have no leaders, only 'elected representatives' . you have my sympathies.

 

Kevin McDonald, NASHUA

 

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'I've got a mind like a steel wassitsname'

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Dear Gerry,

 

I liked this part;

 

"Domestic cats hunt and kill 300 million wild animals a year; I don't see the government banning people from owning cats. So why then should they ban people from owning dogs to hunt foxes? This law is a complete waste of time, it has a political agenda which unfortunately is the only thing that matters to governments nowadays!"

 

We have two cats, one a particularly large tom cat and the other a quite small female, both are extremely well fed and both, kill wild creatures with remarkable tenacity. They both bring and sometimes drag a vast array of kills home. Hares, rabbits, stoats, weasels, pheasants, partridges, ducks, pigeons, rooks, crows, magpies, rats, mice, voles, moles, and every other type of local bird imaginable.

 

Now these kills from just two cats appear every single day, week upon week, year upon year. Even though they are like I said, extremely well fed by us on the usual pet food stuff. Now I live in a country village and the village is full of cats. The surrounding villages are also full of cats. So it’s not hard to imagine the sheer amount of wild creatures that get killed merely for "sport" by the local community’s population of "domestic" feline pets?

 

The RSPCA has campaigned vigorously for the ban on fox hunting and ban on hunting with dogs. Strange then that they don't campaign for a ban on keeping what surely has to be the most vicious, determined, hunting/killing machine which kills for pure pleasure. Domestic cats love nothing more than torturing their prey before finally becoming bored and killing it. This can go on for an hour or more and very few species within our natural world, apart from humans of course, behave in such a vicious way. So why don’t we see Madam Ballard embarking on a campaign to ban domestic cats seeing as they kill for seemingly pure pleasure or “sport”? Perhaps she doesn’t because in one fell swoop she’d see around a third of the nations support disappear for the RSPCA along with the support from the billion pound pet food industry!

 

Dear All,

 

Fox hunts kill very few foxes compared to their local fox populations and contrary to hunting propaganda, hunting with hound’s remains the least effective method of fox control. Fox hunters hunt foxes for “sport”. The same applies to every other branch of field sports. It’s high time that every one in fox hunting AND field sports in general started to tell it how it is instead of looking for excuses as to why it is they take part in their various pastimes.

 

Ask yourselves, what is our reason for catching fish? Is it so far away from other sportsmen and women? Do we not catch fish for “sport”, and the pleasure it gives us?

 

This damned government banned legally held hand guns, to stop the spread of illegally held guns in criminal hands presumably. Now we have soaring rates of gun related crime with hand guns freely available to the criminal elements.

 

They banned fox hunting. I live right in the heart of fox hunting country and I can tell you all now that this government hasn’t any idea about the sheer determination and resolve field sports has to fight the ban. What hunting is looking forward to now are court cases brought against them. Court cases which will prove beyond doubt that the ill drafted legislation remains almost impossible to uphold in the courts. Because it’s only within the court system that this draconian legislation becomes fully tested. It’s the reason why the CA and fox hunting refused to bow and why the CA still remains extremely strong. The CA, hunting, and general support from the whole of the field sports community means it has a bottomless pit of perpetually generated funds to take on these cases. These are very long term strategies capable of fighting enormous legal battles. Those that said the CA would die once fox hunting got banned have been proved wholly wrong. (I listened to this opinion way back in the days of SACG) Those that continue to say the CA will eventually die remain pitifully wrong. Opinion goalposts on when the CA will capitulate remain merely that, opinions that constantly get moved back whilst the CA surge ahead. Field sports are quietly preparing themselves for battle and it’s a battle they are determined to win because they rightly view the fox hunters as a standard raised against all of them. Angling, has never, ever, had the organisational skills that field sports has or their 100% unity and the massive funding capability these sportsmen and women muster in defence of their sports. Make absolutely no mistake; this government has woefully underestimated the forces now amassed before it. They thought taking on fox hunters remained just that. A piece of draconian legislation brought in against a minority group to placate backbench support for other matters. ( Its probably a fact that unless the government required back bench support at a particular time, the fox hunting debate would have never made the end of a debating session getting traditionally “talked out” of session) Now the government are on the battle field they remain unable to withdraw. It has no choice but to fight a battle it hoped it never would and all this governments’ anti-CA bluster just served to make the CA stronger. Watch the courts now as it becomes clear just how clever the CA has been in bringing this government onto the battle field.

 

And before Peter blows his familiar hunting horn warning angling not to be part of CA because they seek to highjack us all, know this;

The CA never wanted Peters “angling” in the first place. It sees it as a pretty much dysfunctional group with a very long history for in-fighting and disunity. Field sports will only safeguard its future by being totally united whilst calling upon its unity for perpetual funding. The CA and field sports already has that and Peter’s “angling” doesn’t come remotely close to measuring up. Never did.

 

This government also said they would “never” ban smoking in public places so why is it now that it’s cabinet is divided over the issue as elements within government push for another ill conceived and ill thought out plan to ban another freedom of choice? Smoking is undoubtedly bad for you, but like a lot of other ridiculously drafted legislation aimed at banning something, the anti-public smoking ban is littered with flaws and so called guidelines that businesses can’t begin to fathom out.

 

Then there’s the issue of our kids being our future? And a government that sought to feed our future properly in schools. It took a lone TV chef to force a vote hungry government to change its course over feeding our nation’s kid’s absolute crap in our schools because it was the “cheaper” option. Why didn’t they look at school meals well before Jamie Oliver did? Did Jamie suss out that he could get our nations kids fed properly because this government reacts swiftly to “vote” preserving-creating issues? Can someone find out if Jamie goes fishing?

 

This government is chipping away at our freedoms and choices aided and abetted by shadowy figures that are pushing forward their own agendas and visions of how we “should” be living our lives. Their vision of political correctness involves trying to brainwash sections of a nation into thinking its “bad” to be involved in a pastime for “sporting” reasons or wrong to kill or capture anything for reasons of “sporting pleasure”. And once we kneel in submission agreeing that sporting pleasure is a bad thing, where does that leave us brother anglers?

 

I read a lot of opinions about “angling should not get into bed with hunting”. Do we not hunt? Does not every other branch of field spots hunt? Do we not all partake in our various pastimes for reasons of “sporting pleasure”? Angling remains in its ivory towers aloof from what it is we actually do ourselves.

 

The real danger facing us all is not whether we support hunting. It’s whether we support field sports and the true principles that we all do what we do for sporting pleasure.

 

I fish for sport and remain tremendously proud of my nations sporting heritage. It will take far more than a minority group in parliament and minority groups elsewhere to crush my resolve and determination that our sporting ways of life are not worth fighting for.

Therefore, as an angler who freely admits he enjoys his sporting pleasure, I refuse to take one single step backwards. I fish for sport and I’m proud of the fact that I do.

 

And finally if the CA is reading this, why don’t you send me an email answering the questions I asked back in March? Over to you Countryside Alliance.

 

Regards,

 

Lee.

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Dear Lee,

 

Livebait and coarse deadbaits banned in the Lakes. Scottish authoritarians and salmon lovers ( probably the same people) planning to do the same in Scotland. The thin end of a very large wedge.

 

This particular piece below appealed to me. Sad to say in the years to come as we find ourselves under increasing pressure from the po faced minority in the RSPA, BBC, PETA, central government et al, this person's sentiment will become ever more relevant. Whilst those that currently sit on their hands and tell us that angling is safe, will presumably be doing what..anybody know?

 

'I fish for sport and remain tremendously proud of my nations sporting heritage. It will take far more than a minority group in parliament and minority groups elsewhere to crush my resolve and determination that our sporting ways of life are not worth fighting for.

Therefore, as an angler who freely admits he enjoys his sporting pleasure, I refuse to take one single step backwards. I fish for sport and I'm proud of the fact that I do'

 

regards

Gerry

Edited by argyll

'I've got a mind like a steel wassitsname'

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Just popped in to this thread to let fellow AngNet-ers know that my nose is MUCH better after last night's sudden lapse into unconsciousness over the keyboard. But I have another problem, however - just now, after reading a few of the posts here since my last visit, quite inexplicably my vision has begun to swim and my ears to bleed. Not like me at all. Time for another little lie-down.

"What did you expect to see out of a Torquay hotel bedroom window? Sydney Opera House perhaps? The Hanging Gardens of Babylon? Herds of wildebeest sweeping majestically...?"

 

Basil Fawlty to the old bat, guest from hell, Mrs Richards.

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I'm sorry Lee but you are kidding yourself! Whether it sits well with you or not, you cannot invent this imaginary public support for Fox hunting. It isn't a matter of whether I agree with it or not, regardless of my own personal opinion I'm not as naive as to think that a ban on hunting doesn't mean a wee bit more of anglings protective coating has been eroded, of course it has. However the prognosis has, and always will mean an eventual ban on angling. All field sports will eventually succumb. History points it's finger in that direction. Bear bating, badger bating, cock fighting, dog fighting and on, they've all been eradicated. A century back all of these passtimes would have been deemed acceptable, just like twenty years back Fox hunting was. Unfortunately the passage of time has seen it lose it's Xmas card place in the publics heart. If you were to conduct a straw poll I can guarantee you that the vast majority of the public would tick the ban box. It's not even a debatable point. The question is, will we accelerate anglings descent by aligning ourselves with the Fox hunters? I'm still undecided....

 

Some people, who possibly have another agenda, want us to believe that the public is apathetic to this issue, and that it's another act of unwarranted and unpopular social engineering from the modern Labour party. That's not so! I'm no lover of Blairs government either, but, and heres the rub, whether you like it or not, the greater majority of the voting public ARE! No amount of bleating by diehard Tories is going to change that fact. At least not until the next election at the earliest. And why are they our elected government? Well because they have given the greater majority of the public what they want on a wide range of issues. Nannying? A penchant for pandering to PC Liberals? Yeh, probably, because that's what the voters want. Three terms, and almost certainly the next one as well, underline the fact!

 

You can rant till you're blue in the face, the unalterable fact is that Fox hunting is a no no as far as the British public are concerned!

Slodger (Chris Hammond.)

 

'We should be fishin'

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