What lb line for float fishing for perch with lobworms

[tiddlertamer]

I'm now going to disagree with most of what's been written so far

 

Line strength should be dictated by what rod you're using. There's no point using 6lb line with a light trotting rod, or 3lb with an Avon. So what rod do you have in mind TT?

 

I do agree with Arbocop about hooklengths though. It seems silly not to use one, because you will get snagged at some point, plus the swivel really does reduce line twist. Strength of hooklength will be determined by what mainline you use, how pressured the perch are, and how snaggy the river is.

 

 

For what it's worth, my usual big perch set-up is a 12ft 1.25lb tc avon rod, 6lb mainline, 6lb double strength hooklength (joined by a small swivel), size 6 wide gape barbed hook, top-and-bottom float taking plenty of shot. The shot can be moved around so that you can trot or present the bait hard on the bottom without the flow pulling it around. Most of my big perch have come to static lobs.

 

The rod will be one of two:

A Hardys Marksmen 13ft specialist float rod - rated for reel lines between 2lb and 5lb

or

A 11ft John Wilson Signature Avon rod - rated for reel lines between 3lb and 8lb.

 

I tend to like fishing more tucked away swims, often with lots of trees and foilage nearbye so am increasingly using the 11ft rod for practical reasons. ie I don't strike into branches...

 

A lack of hooklengths is partly down to laziness but also the fear that with my all thumbs approach to knots, especially in cold weather, two knots increases the chances of a knot failure compared to just one... Poor excuse methinks but honest if nothing else...

Edited October 20, 2010 by tiddlertamer

[Steve Walker]

I definitely think it's worth moving if you don't catch fairly soon and have tried a few bait/depth combinations. As I mentioned earlier it's a matter of playing the percentages - something that US boat anglers like Newt will confirm. You may catch if you stay put, but you're probably more likely to do so if you move.

 

My fear would be that I'm in the right place but the wrong time of day, and if I move I'll be in the wrong place at the right time!

[Rob Ward]

The rod will be one of two:

A Hardys Marksmen 13ft specialist float rod - rated for reel lines between 2lb and 5lb

or

A 11ft John Wilson Signature Avon rod - rated for reel lines between 3lb and 8lb.

 

I tend to like fishing more tucked away swims, often with lots of trees and foilage nearbye so am increasingly using the 11ft rod for practical reasons. ie I don't strike into branches...

 

A lack of hooklengths is partly down to laziness but also the fear that with my all thumbs approach to knots, especially in cold weather, two knots increases the chances of a knot failure compared to just one... Poor excuse methinks but honest if nothing else...

 

Why not pre-tie your hook links?

[gozzer]

I've only fished one river that contained crays so am not qualified to comment on them. However on my local rivers the perch feed on both fish and insects, so I don't think it's just following fish shoals. I suspect it's a question of getting the maximum food for the amount of energy required.

 

Hi Steve, I wondered if you subscribe to the theory that perch fit into two catagories. One that feeds on fish early in it's life, while the other carries on feeding on invertebrates etc for much longer. The former growing much faster than the other. I've seen it said that this happens regardless of available food, which I would have thought would be the main factor.

 

John.

 

PS, sorry TT I know it's veered a bit off topic, but it kind of fits.

Edited October 20, 2010 by gozzer

[Steve Burke]

My fear would be that I'm in the right place but the wrong time of day, and if I move I'll be in the wrong place at the right time!

 

That's understandable. However the more experience you get, the more often you'll be able to second guess the fish.

 

The most important factor as to where perch will feed is light intensity. The second on a river is current. So there are certain swims, not to mention certain areas of swims, that do better in given conditions/times.

 

You won't always be right - I'm certainly not, especially on a new water.

 

However I find moving around is one of the quickest ways to gain experience. And the more experience (or data as I know you're a scientist), the more you have to go on, and the more your guesses will be correct.

 

You might not believe it when you see how I approach Wingham, but by nature I'm a hunter rather than a trapper. So moving around also appeals to my hunting instinct. But if I thought I'd catch more by staying put and trapping I wouldn't hesitate to do so.

[Steve Burke]

Hi Steve, I wondered if you subscribe to the theory that perch fit into two catagories. One that feeds on fish early in it's life, while the other carries on feeding on invertebrates etc for much longer. The former growing much faster than the other. I've seen it said that this happens regardless of available food, which I would have thought would be the main factor.

 

John.

 

PS, sorry TT I know it's veered a bit off topic, but it kind of fits.

 

Yes, I do. See this article of mine that discusses this for various species including perch: http://www.anglersnet.co.uk/Coarse-Fishing...s_for_chub.html .

 

And it's not off-topic at all. I'm sure it applies to river perch, and chub for that matter as well.

 

Indeed, one of my idols, Fred J. Taylor, relates in early editions of "Angling in Earnest" that he found that there were two different types of perch in the Upper Great Ouse in the 50s. They had different shapes, and more importantly different habits.

 

However, I still believe the key point is maximum food intake for minimum energy expended, and competition with other perch plays a part here. Perch hunt in different ways and I discuss this in this article: http://www.anglersnet.co.uk/Coarse-Fishing...erch_guide.html .

 

Having said that, there are times when numbers of perch on small rivers do often follow the fry shoals. One of them is onto the shallows at dawn and sometimes dusk as well, especially in summer. Light intensity again?

 

Importantly though, I've found my local perch also move around from swim to swim when they're feeding on invertebrates rather than fish, and this is the point I was trying to make.

 

Of course some swims will hold these roving perch longer than others. Some swims hold them only in certain conditions. But in my local rivers you couldn't guarantee where in given conditions they'd be. But you could predict with some confidence that they'd be in one of half a dozen swims.

 

The problem was which one!

[tiddlertamer]

Why not pre-tie your hook links?

 

 

Good point. I have in fact bought some pre tied hook lengths but struggled on the river bank when attaching to the main line.

 

I believe the following two methods are popular.

 

The first method is to tie a loop knot in the main line and then feed the hook length loop over the main line loop and then feeding the hook back through the main line loop before pulling tight. I struggled with this technique on the bank as my loop knots on the main line were a bit ham fisted.

 

The second method is the water knot. This looks simpler on paper as it just entails one manouver with both lines.

 

Which is most effective?

 

See:

 

http://www.pleasurefishing.com/html/knots.htm

Edited October 20, 2010 by tiddlertamer

[Anderoo]

TT, on the rod choice, it's up to you really. I guess it comes down to the expected size of the perch and the proximity of snags. They do like to make mad dashes to the reeds/trees/whatever and you need to be able to keep them out. I used my trotting rod and pin once and it cost me a big fish - I couldn't stop it getting into the bankside foilage. So now I always use the avon.

 

With the hooklength knot, I would still recommend using a little swivel. You can still tie them up at home with a swivel on the end. If you need to swap hooklengths, just tie it on with your normal knot (half blood, grinner, etc.).

 

Steve, I have read the same thing about big perch feeding on gravelly shallows at dawn in Tony Miles books. I really should try it, but dusk is much more civilised!

[Steve Burke]

Steve, I have read the same thing about big perch feeding on gravelly shallows at dawn in Tony Miles books. I really should try it, but dusk is much more civilised!

 

On my rivers at least this happens more in summer, when dawn is usually better than dusk.

 

In the winter it happens less often, and then dusk is usually better for perch, probably because of higher water temperatures.

 

On winter dawns I'm more likely to get chub, especially if it's cold. However in very cold conditions I've almost always found that even the chub feed much better late in the day. In fact on bright but cold days the best time of all for my chub (from both rivers and stillwaters) has been after dark when frost is forming.

 

Perch as you know very rarely feed after dark on most waters. One of the few exceptions was many years ago on a Perchfishers Get-Together on the Great Ouse. In those days it contained large numbers of small and medium-sized perch, and I suspect they were starving!

[Anderoo]

On my rivers at least this happens more in summer, when dawn is usually better than dusk.

 

In the winter it happens less often, and then dusk is usually better for perch, probably because of higher water temperatures.

 

On winter dawns I'm more likely to get chub, especially if it's cold. However in very cold conditions I've almost always found that even the chub feed much better late in the day. In fact on bright but cold days the best time of all for my chub (from both rivers and stillwaters) has been after dark when frost is forming.

 

Perch as you know very rarely feed after dark on most waters. One of the few exceptions was many years ago on a Perchfishers Get-Together on the Great Ouse. In those days it contained large numbers of small and medium-sized perch, and I suspect they were starving!

 

Yes, Mr Miles was also talking about summer (I meant to put that in my post but forgot!) which is why I haven't tried it. Dawn in summer is about 3am, forget it!

 

I have found similar things as you with the chub. Afternoons are generally best and if it's really cold and clear, after dark. I have done very little chubbing at dawn or in mornings (basically because the afternoons are so good I've never really felt the need to try) so can't say whether they are also good times or not.