ACA Mag. Bailey's piece???

[Sportsman]

Blimey Leon, I felt bad enough already

Actually, the vast majority of the mackeral I use I catch myself one at a time off the rocks, and freeze them, but I do take the point.

If we are that concerned about fish welfare we should just stop fishing for them.

It's about time that anglers woke up and accepted that what they do is perceived as a "blood sport" by a certain section of the community. I don't think livebaiting helps our argument, but to these people that won't make much difference.

 

[ 11. October 2005, 12:44 AM: Message edited by: Sportsman ]

[PatrickLeigh]

Peter Waller:

........it is whether it will be used to turn a largely supportive non angling public against angling itself.

 

Like Jim, I am uncomfortable with live baiting. But more than that I am concerned that it will be used against us and I will be unable to justify it. Please note that I said 'justify', not 'defend'.

 

I remember the late Martin Gay saying much the same thing. In this day and age we do not need to livebait in order to catch pike.

PLEASE, people, look at what you are doing/

 

Threads like these on angling forums will cause more grief to the future of our sport than the use of livebaits/keepnets ever will. I have not read JB piece, however, by the snippets here and on other sites, how on earth he can publish these comments as a commitee member of the ACA - A defender of British Waterways and Anglers - beggars belief!

 

At best, these are mis-placed personal thoughts, at worst, they are a major blow to Angling in the UK.

 

To read further contributors on this site agreeing with these comments and stating many a harmful and vitriolic (in the eyes of the antis) statements also makes a mockery of the very point of this forum.

 

I do not propose we bury our heads in the sand, however, we should not discuss to this level on an open forum.

 

Jim Gibbinson: I have read your published pieces for many years, purchased your books etc and admired you as a superb angler, however, after reading your posts on this very forum has made me very sad, very sad indeed. As Mark has suggested, I think you need to hang up your rods and find another pastime! The level in which you reply, shows major contempt for your peers, the industry and the UK's population of anglers.

 

For those who are interested, and by the looks of the many who have responded in a similar nature, your new hobby can be found @ www.pisces.demon.co.uk ... yes, this is the home of the UK anti angling group. By the looks of it, as the site has not been updated since the year 2000 it looks like your timing and switching of alleigance could be well timed and you can get them up to speed about all that is cruel/wrong with this hobby that many enjoy, many of you have made money from etc

 

For gawds sake, stop, and stop NOW!

[Bob Bradford]

Mr Nice, Yes I am an open match angler and have traveled all over the UK to indulge in my particular branch of the sport, I respect any other anglers wishes NOT to do the same, just as I respect some of my fellow anglers on here not wishing to use live baits to catch pike,use a keep-net etc, for me, this is down to personal choice and free will, I ask that others do not take away my or anyone Else's legal right to indulge in the sport/pastime I love, in the way I wish.

 

Leon Rosskilly, Superbly argued and informed post , very well done .

[Chris Burt, SAA]

Personally I find it sad that an angler of the calibre of John Bailey should seek to ban certain aspects of legitimate angling. The rarefied fishing he subscribes to for himself of mostly fishing with “a hook cut off at the bend” is so far removed from most anglers objectives that I find it difficult to classify his current activities within the range of what we would normally recognise as a rod and line angler.

We have already gone to considerable lengths to produce a consensus view on anglings practices, with the “Code” brokered by SAA (formerly SACG), and endorsed by virtually every major UK angling organisation, plus many respected individuals. That fully covers live-baiting, the use of keep-nets, barbed hooks, and every other aspect we could think of. If you want to view it please go to the SAA site. All are legitimate angling practices, with care all are acceptable.

Can I reiterate the point made by a number of others now that once we start picking off the individual aspects of angling to which we personally do not subscribe, we alienate other anglers. So we divide again into small sections who act against each other, but surely we have more in common with other anglers than those outside our sport? Make no mistake, unless we learn to act together angling as a sporting activity will diminish, and we will be the losers. Peta view every reduction of angling activity as a great result in the same way that we would view the capture of a good fish, so reducing the perceived areas where we are “vulnerable” does nothing accept play right into their hands. They would like to see angling banned, restrictions are merely a half-way house to that objective.

[Jim Gibbinson]

Reading through the foregoing posts it would seem that if an angler admits that certain aspects of fishing cause him discomfiture, and if he tries to make his own approach to the sport as humane as possible, a public expression of those views makes him some sort of "traitor to the cause".

 

Mmmmmm - that's an interesting viewpoint.

[Peter Waller]

Like you, Jim, I find this assumption that some of our comments make some of us traitors to the cause an interesting point. My understanding of all that you have said is that you want to see an improvement in angling generally. Whether you, me, or the next man is right in our interpretation of that desire is besides the point, the intention is right. In the past knotted nets have been oulawed, was angling wrong to concede on that one? Because, judging by some of the comments made, the answer to that one is 'yes'. Okay, an extreme example, but I'm sure that you see my point.

[poledark]

Is there room "on the block" for my head as well as yours Jim?

 

I have used livebaits in the past, I have shot pigeons and squirrels and starlings and crows, and for some reason I find all of these abhorrent now.

 

Is it an age thing?? Why is it that I now argue fiercly with a guy who sets his dogs on to harmless rabbits.....why do I now consider someone who breeds and fattens Pheasants simply in order to shoot them?

 

I also have questioned my continued interest in my fishing, but have decided that with all the experience I have amassed over the years that as it is not my INTENTION to kill or maim the fish then it is acceptable.

 

For all the livebaiters on here, ask youself whether you EVER have any qualms about TETHERING a LIVE creature in order for it to be eaten simply in the name of sport. If you don't then you and I are simply worlds apart, the same distance as between me and the Pheasant shooter.

 

And I make no apologies for my thoughts, except to say that as I have got older, I have come to consider almost every living creature as having a right to life, and have also come to realise that the vast majority of non anglers/shooters have probably always held those views.

 

Let us hope we do not awaken those views.

 

Den

[Paul Boote]

The Old Tiger-Hunter Syndrome, Den, I know it well!

 

Virtually every one of India's top tiger-conservationists (I knew several of them - great and fascinating men, mostly) of the past thirty-odd years were great tiger-hunters in their youth.

 

Yes, increasing compassion does come with age; wisdom, sometimes, too.

[Dave Lumb]

Peter Waller:

John Bailey's words were, in the context of fish care, was that 'I strongly question live baiting. I query treble hooks'.

Is that all? Storm in a tea cup.

[slodger]

'...and if he tries to make his own approach to the sport as humane as possible...'

 

I don't see how anyone can interpret that comment as anything other than an admission that you see angling as at least partly inhumane Jim. You find a passtime inhumane yet you continue to subscribe to it. How contemptible is that?? :confused: