Bishops block the benefits cap.

[Steve Walker]

We're stuffed, the public simply won't accept what has to be done until it becomes impossible to shield them from reality any longer - which is what is happening in Greece.

[big_cod]

We're stuffed, the public simply won't accept what has to be done until it becomes impossible to shield them from reality any longer - which is what is happening in Greece.

 

 

They can start by a windfall tax on the energy companys they are ripping the arse out of people in this country but the goverment dont care as they grabbing the now 20% vat on everybodys super inflated bills.

 

paul.

Edited January 25, 2012 by big_cod

[Ken L]

Well, we seem to have settled on benefits but such is the way of AN threads.

There are a few interesting misconceptions bouncing about though which are interesting.

 

First there's this strange idea that NI is somehow ringfenced for paying benefits, pensions and the NHS.

Erm.....No.

 

Then there's this idea of "The law says".

Well then NT, I'm not sure if you've been following the news but what the law says if going to change fairly dramatically and as of April 2013, none of the benefits that you've talked about will exist. They will all be rolled into a single "Universal Credit".

 

Steve, you're right, we are stuffed. The benefit bill is crippling the country. It costs more than Health (The NHS), defence and transports (Roads and rail) combined and the money isn't coming in to pay for it. but he irony is, a lot of that bill is going into the pockets of the already rich in the form of high property rents that are paid for through housing benefit.

[Now there's a right un.]

The law doesn't, as far as I know, state what is needed for a decent existence. Various charities and political groups do, and they base it on some notional % of average income.

 

 

 

 

 

On every benefit form it states "This award is the minimum law states you need to live on" or very similar.

 

 

You state you accept you will get very little if you lost your employment. I say bigger the fool you.

You are paying for a decent liveable income through your NI are you not for the purpose of protecting you if you need benefit.

What's the point of doing things properly when at time of need you are left destitute.

Government must love people like you.

With people prepared to accept crap contractual obligations can go out the window as they see fit.

The Government is bound by contract the minute they take the first NI payment.

 

There is still enough money in this country to be fair..

 

To those who bemoan the welfare bill know this.

Go along with all these changes and when YOU need it it will not be there.

 

Governments can remove scroungers and those that have no entitlement.

They can also stop benefit for those, like millionaires, who really do not need it.

Why haven't they done so already? If savings are so great why is it not done?

The answer is because it is all BS...those on benefit are the easy target and the populace is now indoctrinated to see benefit recipients as enemy number one. FFS is everyone in the country a sheep? Does no-one see beyond the BS?

 

 

 

What is happening is the Americanisation of our UK welfare structure.

[Ken L]

The answer is because it is all BS...those on benefit are the easy target and the populace is now indoctrinated to see benefit recipients as enemy number one.

 

Goo back and read the first post.

[Now there's a right un.]

Goo back and read the first post.

 

 

 

I have read the first post again.

 

You maintain a cap is sensible. I do not.

Why should it be capped?

 

For those who are not scroungers, no mention of a cap on benefits was made when National Insurance payments were taken.

 

Therefore this cap is a change of contractual obligation without agreement from all parties bound by contract.

This breeches the Treaty of Rome which governs all contracts.

 

Good old Bishops for actually realising what this cap, if passed, would likely lead to.

 

 

Those who receive benefits are not responsible for the economic woes we today see.

But as the majority have paid for their benefit when working why should they see any restriction to it when they need it.

 

I say again the simple fact is that Law dictates you need a certain amount of money to live on.

If wages in many areas are below that amount then people should be asking why that is?

 

IF SOMEONE HAS PAID FOR THE PROVISION OF BENEFIT THROUGH EMPLOYMENT THEN THEY HAVE THE RIGHT TO EXPECT TO RECEIVE IT AT ITS FULLEST. CHANGING THE RULES AT A LATER DATE IS AN ABSOLUTE SCANDAL.

 

Fraud could be eradicated easily but they seem not to want to tackle that with any enthusiasm.

Edited January 26, 2012 by Now there's a right un.

[Vagabond]

I say again the simple fact is that Law dictates you need a certain amount of money to live on.

If wages in many areas are below that amount then people should be asking why that is?

 

Very simple, in the UK, people's expectations of living standards are way, way too high. So the minimum wage "that Law dictates" is set too high for UK employers to be able to compete with foreign companies.

Many workers (through their unions) have thus priced themselves out of a job.

 

There is no way someone with an ordinary job can afford a television, two cars, a computer and all its accessories, holidays abroad, a free health service, benefits if illness or redundancy hits, and his share of the general cost of the infrastructure that provides him with water, gas, electricity, public services and the like, if over in Asia, there is someone prepared to do the same job for enough to eat and a roof over his head.

 

It is an unpalatable fact, but the reality is beginning to hit Greece and other EU countries. It may hit here before too long.

 

As Steve Walker says, we are stuffed - unless a lot of people wake up real soon.

[big_cod]

Very simple, in the UK, people's expectations of living standards are way, way too high. So the minimum wage "that Law dictates" is set too high for UK employers to be able to compete with foreign companies.

Many workers (through their unions) have thus priced themselves out of a job.

 

There is no way someone with an ordinary job can afford a television, two cars, a computer and all its accessories, holidays abroad, a free health service, benefits if illness or redundancy hits, and his share of the general cost of the infrastructure that provides him with water, gas, electricity, public services and the like, if over in Asia, there is someone prepared to do the same job for enough to eat and a roof over his head.

 

It is an unpalatable fact, but the reality is beginning to hit Greece and other EU countries. It may hit here before too long.

 

As Steve Walker says, we are stuffed - unless a lot of people wake up real soon.

 

Minmum wage to high £6. 08 for gods sake its near on slave labour its 2012 not 1912 incredible.

 

paul.

Edited January 26, 2012 by big_cod

[Vagabond]

Minmum wage to high £6. 08 for gods sake its near on slave labour its 2012 not 1912 incredible.

 

That's right, its 2012, and the bloke moaning about selling his labour at £6.08 is about to lose his job to someone abroad who will accept £3.08

 

 

 

Not all the political posturing in the world is going to prevent that.

[Now there's a right un.]

That's right, its 2012, and the bloke moaning about selling his labour at £6.08 is about to lose his job to someone abroad who will accept £3.08

 

 

 

Not all the political posturing in the world is going to prevent that.

 

 

 

Someone earning £3.08 per hour in say India is earning the equivalent of £21+ per hour as a UK wage.

Indian living costs being that much lower than the UK.

 

£6.08 per hour is no longer a liveable wage for a UK worker. It makes a total of £12,646.40 per annum gross.

This is far below the Government stated average earning of £26,000.00. Government does not take into account regional variations when compiling the figures.

 

Now take your gross wage and then remove Income Tax and NI contributions and you have a figure left of around £10,500 per annum net...

 

Rent is an average of £85 per week = £4420 per annum.

Council Tax is an average of £20 per week = £1040 per annum.

Food bills for families is an average of £75 per week = £3900.

 

Then add in transportation, clothing, utilities, Children, Prescription-Dentist-Optician costs.

 

How can you live on that?

 

A man who earns £100 per annum and spends £99 is a happy man.

A man who earns £100 per annum and spends £101 will always be miserable.

 

Are people here just to exist then without any quality in their life whatsoever?