Israel - some facts

[GlennB]

...... The fight was between a big oafish bar bully and a rather soft-spoken, medium sized Latino sailor from my ship.

.....

 

Research your own country's record of undermining legitimately elected regimes, or sponsoring terrorism, or manipulating world politics to serve its own ends, and ask yourself "who is the bully?".

 

One of the many faults with your parable, and the initial post that started this thread, is that millions - perhaps even the majority - view Israel as the bully, backed up by the even heftier US thug.

[DavyR]

Research your own country's record of undermining legitimately elected regimes, or sponsoring terrorism, or manipulating world politics to serve its own ends, and ask yourself "who is the bully?".

 

At the risk of sounding lyrical again, Hilaire Belloc ended one of his cautionary tales with the line "And always keep tight hold of nurse, for fear of finding something worse".

 

The historian Niall Ferguson has written an interesting piece about what might be the alternative to a single global superpower, which ends:

 

"The prospect of an apolar world should frighten us a great deal more than it frightened the heirs of Charlemagne. If the U.S. is to retreat from the role of global hegemon--its fragile self-belief dented by minor reversals--its critics must not pretend that they are ushering in a new era of multipolar harmony. The alternative to unpolarity may not be multipolarity at all. It may be a global vacuum of power. Be careful what you wish for."

 

http://www.opinionjournal.com/editorial/fe...ml?id=110005244

 

I'd love to think that the world could be a more peaceful place without the influence of the US, but I don't believe that it would be.

[Guest Brumagem Phil]

I'd love to think that the world could be a more peaceful place without the influence of the US, but I don't believe that it would be.

 

I think thats very true.

 

I'm not against the US using its influence to help bring peace around the world, I just wish they'd be more even handed in the way they did it.

[Lid]

Nice story newt, but what if the diminutive sailor had ignored the bully and instead gone and beat up the guys wife and kids?

 

You amaze me each post, there's always something idiotic you add, I must be an idiot chattin to one.

 

I disagree. Phil makes a very valid point very well here especially when you include his next sentence i.e.

 

Or lets imagine it was a knife fight and this diminutive sailor in his frenzy of slashing slashed a few of your shipmates to death.

 

The problem lies with this rather simplistic modern fairytale e-mail.

Edited August 3, 2006 by Lid

[gozzer]

I'd love to think that the world could be a more peaceful place without the influence of the US, but I don't believe that it would be.

 

Having someone assume the mantle of 'World Peacekeeper' is fine in theory Davy, but, if that someone is only doing it to further their own goals and ideals then the pretence will be discovered and Global conflict is the next step. Which will result in the victors imposing their own ideas, which will eventually result in wars, which will result in........... ad infinitum until we finally disappear up our own backsides and annihilate ourselves, then nature will form another hierarchy from another species, which can't do much worse than we are now.

[DavyR]

ad infinitum until we finally disappear up our own backsides and annihilate ourselves, then nature will form another hierarchy from another species, which can't do much worse than we are now.

 

You are having a gloomy day, aren't you? I broadly agree with the points you're making, but that Ferguson article suggests that the US might be the lesser of two weevils, as they say, and looking at the possible alternatives, I'm inclined to agree with him.

 

Someone on the radio the other day said that the difference between the British and the US models of empire was that the Brits tended to stay and make careers and lives for themselves in the countries they colonised, whereas the Yanks tend to go in fast, looking for a quick fix, and then get bored and leave as soon as possible. A lot of truth in that, I think.

[Guest Ferret1959]

The average American is as qualified to give a view on the Arab-Israeli conflct as they were on the IRA situation, amazing what clarity a few thousand miles bring you. The Israelis are as big a bunch of shites as you could wish to meet, I spent most of 2003 in Israel and found it home to the most evil narrow minded pricks I have yet to meet.

 

 

I think most places in this World has it's share of shites and narrow minded pricks but.............

 

Yasmin went to Israel and said the people she met were some of the most friendly caring folk you could ever meet.

She was on a trip organised for visits to Christian sites throughout the Country.

 

She wants to go again and I would love to take her but at the moment I'm afraid our trip will have to wait.

 

Jon, you can't tar them all with the same brush.

[gozzer]

You are having a gloomy day, aren't you?

 

Yeah, sorry about my mood Davy. It's my medication, I stupidly miscalculated and was late ordering a repeat prescription. I went two days without it.

Not taking it does make me feel grumpy, but I've got it now, and should soon be feeling happy again.

 

 

PS, Can't wait for next week it's Snow Whites turn.

[corydoras]

I think most places in this World has it's share of shites and narrow minded pricks but.............

 

Yasmin went to Israel and said the people she met were some of the most friendly caring folk you could ever meet.

She was on a trip organised for visits to Christian sites throughout the Country.

 

She wants to go again and I would love to take her but at the moment I'm afraid our trip will have to wait.

 

Jon, you can't tar them all with the same brush.

FWIW I think that they are about 50/50. About half of the Israeli's/Jews that I have meat were really nice people and the other have were well lets just say that I found them to be a little bit too "superior" for my liking. Don't forget at the end of the day we are all just folks and you get good folk and bad folk everywhere. Its governments that cause wars, not people. I can't think of one country in the world that has a good government.

 

Maybe we should burn all national flags and do away with countries and government, after all we are the only species on earth that seem to need them.

[DavyR]

Yeah, sorry about my mood Davy. It's my medication, I stupidly miscalculated and was late ordering a repeat prescription. I went two days without it.

 

You can't mention "medication" to a medical librarian without expecting further questioning. PM me if you like, but tell me what you're on and why, and I'll cheer you up by telling you all about the possible side effects.

 

What's all that about Snow White, btw?