Commercial Fisheries they can't all be bad, can they?

[Anderoo]

Here's a nice example that might blur the boundaries further - Willow lake at Linch Hill is now day ticket, after being syndicate for a very long time. Its huge roach are almost legendary, and it's not a big lake. I believe there's even a cafe there now. Did the 2lb+ and 3lb+ roach have more 'value' when it was a syndicate fished by proper dedicated roach anglers, rather than now when any old tom can turn up, pay his money, get something from the cafe, and cast out a maggot feeder?

Anyone?

[Anderoo]

Many here are familiar with Wingham, and would cite it as a good example of a natural water. However it really is nothing of the sort - dug out initially for gravel, stocked with a few species of fish for the purposes of fishing, and very carefully managed to that end. To be clear, I'm not criticising Wingham at all (if only there were more waters like it!) but it's an easy jump from here to say that a wingham bream has less value than a commercial perch; after all the bream was stocked into a water where it finds it pretty much impossible to successfully breed, just so it would grow big and be a target for anglers. The perch happened to be in the commercial mostly by accident, find it very much to their liking and breed successfully. So is the bream really a more valued capture than the perch?

.

Anyone?

[Dales]

Anderoo, I'm not sure who you are hoping to answer these points and as I can take pleasure in fishing all sorts of places and dont really try to bench mark a fish from one water against one for another but do take pleasure in catching from some venues more then others.

 

In my mind with the Linch Hill example the fishing "Worthiness" or "Difficulty" is just the same by it a syndicate with members free to pick from loads of swims or a rammed day ticket with every peg taken. I often get hauled up when I refer to snobbery in angling but I do think it exists and I bet there will be anglers that think a big Roach from Willow or Christchurch a few years back is of more merit then one caught in the coming years.

[Anderoo]

Cheers Dales. I was hoping to get answers from those who think that any fish from a commercial is 'worth' less than one from a more natural water, just because it's from a commercial. In my mind, it's not black and white, as I hope the above examples demonstrate.

[John Weddup]

So is lynch hil a small muddy hole in the ground stuffed full of fish and water the colour of clay because of it as in most typical commercial waters. Or is it a big natural water being called a commercial because it is operated on commercial grounds such as my reference earlier to Suffolk water Park specimen lake.

 

John

[Anderoo]

It's neither. It's a small clear water operated on a day ticket basis with an on-site cafe, not overstocked.

 

The perch commercial is very small, coloured water, overstocked.

[John Weddup]

My feelings about the small overstocked commercial roach and perch is they wouldn't be there without the huge intervention by man.

 

You could try and bring Wingham into it as you did earlier as the same could be said. The big difference is the stocking policy at wingham is not one that will harm the fish. far from it. The stocking policy on a lot of commercials is way over the excepted level and often needs drastic measures to keep the fish alive in low oxygen levels. Any losses are rapidly replaced with yet more stock fish.

 

Taken to its limit no doubt a hand reared perch could be grown in perfect temperatures and food supply and easily beat the record perch at present.

 

I didn't say any commercial fish was worthless or that the commercial aspect is black and white because it is clearly not. However catching 2 lb roach from a commercial, where I can go and catch one after another, is ok now and again but to me not as much as an achievement as catching a 2lb roach from the river. Its not the fish that's different its my pleasure and sense of achievement. It was those that I thought we went fishing for.

 

John

Edited August 15, 2013 by John Weddup

[Dave H]

Hi John

 

There are some very nice pits but they are all expensive syndicates with full membership and the few clubs with a decent water on the books are closed to new members and so that leaves the waters that are controlled by clubs with open membership. There is a reason they are open because of the waters you get access to, they all come with issues. The £50 ticket club I mentioned in an earlier post used to be closed membership but like some other clubs in the area it has had to open its books as membership has reduced as many of the fisheries have suffered some serious poaching in the last few years plus the waters are not so nice anymore as new people frequent them. This leads to an even worse downward spiral and they deteriate even further.

 

The problems of the Lea catchment area are well debated/documented and I don't really want to bang on about predation from Cormorants and EE's plus water extraction/lack of flow/to much flow/flooding/pollution/crays/thugs etc but these and other problems has created the unusual situation of low stocks but huge specimen fish. Oddly no one seems to fully understand what is going on in the Lea Valley that has caused the odd stock levels. So many of the waters are difficult but the rewards are there with many captures appearing in the mags. But fishing should be more then just hard work all the time.

 

Obviously being in London, there is an issue of supply and demand with the good syndicates being well over subscribed, even some of the ropey day ticket waters have now gone members only. There are just to many anglers in London and its surrounding area and many anglers in East London join clubs and syndicates a long way from home. Friday afternoon and night plenty of anglers head through the black wall tunnel to the fisheries of Kent/Surrey or head off to Bedfordshire. The ironic thing is that many of the anglers that fish the river Lea have traveled long distances in search of a monster Chub/Perch and a chance of celebrity angling fame. That's a little cruel but many of the circuit Drennan/Fox cup anglers fish the area on campaigns to add some PB's and try to make a name for themselves.

 

There are fisheries in Essex but they are just to crowded and Essex is home of the Carp fisheries that I dislike. Wall to wall Carp and very little else plus they are just to busy.

 

The fisheries I mentioned in my original post Tanyards/Bury Hill are not local and a far distance from me. I started the thread because the commercials near me are the literal hole in the ground types. With so many anglers in the area and unusual situation with wild fish stocks you only need to dig a basic hole and get anglers wanting to fish it. A few day ticket waters I drive past on the way to the Lea often have signs up saying full and so not excepting any more customers on those days. As the ones around here are pretty dull/basic I was interested in whether anyone knew better ones. The commercials locally do not have a negative effect on the fishing as those who want good quality mixed fishing and cant get on a local syndicate head off to other areas if they can afford the cost and time. The commercials offer a chance to actually catch fish but if I want to fish a commercial I head south of London this does tell you something about the sort of commercial local to me.

 

If all I was interested in was chalking up huge PB's and getting my face in the weekly rags then I would not consider fishing out side the Lea Valley but I enjoy the odd fish being pulled over the landing net block from time to time. Oddly the biggest export from East London/Hertfordshire is anglers.

Great post Dale and 100% i agree. Living where john is has still the appeal of real fishing. The rivers Avon and Severn,the broads and the fens are atleast to me real fishing. i used to make trips twice a year to the fens and twice a year to the Royalty fishery. Either fishing off the weirs or i might have a session at Throop down there and felt like i was really fishing.

I am not bothered in PB's. I am not bothered in taking pictures of a big carp or tench or roach. I enjoy catching it ,enjoy looking at it and i will enjoy talking about it and then i put it back feeling pleased with myself. But it's a big thing here in the SE more than anywhere whether it be carp or tench. Bream down here seem to be more or less extinct. I believe Cormorants also have helped to kill off coarse fishing too. If you are not a carp angler in the South East then be prepared to fill your tank up with fuel and go west or north a long way or buy a lottery ticket and if you win make one.

[RUDD]

There are plenty of good commercials about that offer a variety of waters, stocking density and species along with a tackle shop, cafe and toilet facilities.

In my neck of the woods Suffolk water park has all of the above plus easy parking near swims.

The fishery has a big specimen lake, a few match lakes, a traditional, a canal, a dougnut, a learners pool and a couple of others.

By no means is the fishing EASY, I have seen plenty in my few visits struggle including myself - Infact I had to work hard and try alot of methods until I found what the fish wanted.

I think there is a major difference between a well managed commercial complex and a hole in the ground fishery.

 

There are some on here that seem to think if its not a river with a split cane rod complete with a centrepin its not cricket - sorry but cricket has evolved, just think 20/20.

F1, darts, snooker, whatever - all sports have evolved in some way due to changes in the rules or technology.

 

If you dont like commercials you dont have to fish them, its all about choice - I choose to fish club waters 90% of the time as my time spent angling these days is short, I have paid my ticket and I can arrive and leave (in accordance to rules) when I want.

9% of my time is spent sea fishing and about 1% at commercials, mainly in the winter after the silverfish.

If I do fish at a commercial I like to get my monies worth and spend a good five or six hours fishing - just about most of the daylight you get in the winter!

 

There are alot of anglers who like the security offered by commercials, some the ease of getting to pegs (old age, disabled, lazy), some who are not on club tickets, some who only fish a few times a year and some who just like the convienience of the whole package. I know a good few who fish the various ones dotted around my area a few times a year so they can try a different venue every time, how many clubs offer a ticket with the equivilant of 52 venues at seven quid a week?

 

Like I said somewhere above - its about choice and the choice is yours.

[Phone]

All,

 

This one is considered one of the best. Tokyo’s Ichigaya Fish Center.

 

 

And I think this is one one of the worst. They take a couple tons of catfish entrap them in a small area and then they starve them so you can have fun.

 

 

Phone