ACCIDENTS AT SEA

[glennk]

My advice to you Paul is dont ask advice about such things in a forum as all you will get is confused. For matters of Law consult a soliciter. Yes they arent cheap but they know the law better than anyone and they wont guess at an answer.

 

I assume charter skippers take out public liability insurance to cover accidents anyway ??? and a legal issues insurance like the ones taken out alongside car insurance. Wouldnt such an insurer have a legal department to deal with these matters ? get the policy document out and let the insurer deal with it.

Edited May 2, 2006 by glennk

[Guest binatone]

My advice to you Paul is dont ask advice about such things in a forum as all you will get is confused. For matters of Law consult a soliciter. Yes they arent cheap but they know the law better than anyone and they wont guess at an answer.

 

I assume charter skippers take out public liability insurance to cover accidents anyway ??? and a legal issues insurance like the ones taken out alongside car insurance. Wouldnt such an insurer have a legal department to deal with these matters ? get the policy document out and let the insurer deal with it.

I did not realise that big cod was asking for advice. I thought he was just opening a thread and wanted to get peoples thoughts on what they thought of the matter.

A good thread and some interesting points raised I thought?

I am sure if big cod had a problem and needed advice on legality he would of taken legal advice.

Does this mean he can hold us responsible now for advising him if anything goes wrong with one of his paying customers? O my god look what you’ve done glenk.

[big_cod]

I did not realise that big cod was asking for advice. I thought he was just opening a thread and wanted to get peoples thoughts on what they thought of the matter.

A good thread and some interesting points raised I thought?

I am sure if big cod had a problem and needed advice on legality he would of taken legal advice.

Does this mean he can hold us responsible now for advising him if anything goes wrong with one of his paying customers? O my god look what you’ve done glenk.

 

LETS GET SOME THING VERY CLEAR HERE I AM NOT ASKING ANYBODY FOR ADVICE ON ANY LEGAL MATTERS.

But what i am saying this could occur on any angling trip as ian burrett said weather conditions can change at any time and even the wash off a coaster and you cant be holding everybodys hand all of the time,if you have been on an angling boat and maybe some of you have\nt the movement of ANY boat LARGE OR SMALL can change in a second what i am trying to say is if this occurs it is not the skippers fault and as any skipper with experience will tell you the movement of the boat is not detured by him .

As for insurance anybody who runs a charter anglingboat that is registered under the code of practice CANNOT GET PUBLIC LIABILITY INSURANCE UNLESS FULLY UPTO THE CODE OF PRACTICE FOR SMALL COMMERCIAL VESSELS,SO ANYBODY PAYING £10 OR £15 FOR A CHEAP TRIP ABOARD AN ANGLING BOAT THAT IS NOT LICENCED VESSEL ARE NOT INSURED AT SEA.

Edited May 2, 2006 by big_cod

[Huge_Vitae]

LETS GET SOME THING VERY CLEAR HERE I AM NOT ASKING ANYBODY FOR ADVICE ON ANY LEGAL MATTERS.

But what i am saying this could occur on any angling trip

And you are quite right BC.

 

The world revolves around once every day and every day something changes, sooner or later those changes will jump up and bite you on the ass if you are not prepared to listen.

 

Trouble is, IF you go OTT and get everybody coming on board to read and sign the met forcast, and then sign a disclaimer to say that they feel safe to go out in the existing weather conditions, and further to 'rank' their own sealegs on a scale of 1-10. Then sooner or later it will be the norm, and where does it stop?

 

Keep it in perspective, you have to give your safety brief when you are going out. Do you add to it that the Met Office predicts force whatever and the sea state will be whatever and get everybody to sign it and add a DNA sample

 

Just check that your insurance is in force and read through the policy to make sure you are happy with it.

 

After all there is only one place that a dodgy insurance agent is safe...... And that is in Goverment

[big_cod]

And you are quite right BC.

 

The world revolves around once every day and every day something changes, sooner or later those changes will jump up and bite you on the ass if you are not prepared to listen.

 

Trouble is, IF you go OTT and get everybody coming on board to read and sign the met forcast, and then sign a disclaimer to say that they feel safe to go out in the existing weather conditions, and further to 'rank' their own sealegs on a scale of 1-10. Then sooner or later it will be the norm, and where does it stop?

 

Keep it in perspective, you have to give your safety brief when you are going out. Do you add to it that the Met Office predicts force whatever and the sea state will be whatever and get everybody to sign it and add a DNA sample

 

Just check that your insurance is in force and read through the policy to make sure you are happy with it.

 

After all there is only one place that a dodgy insurance agent is safe...... And that is in Goverment

 

Hi hugh,

i just thought i would start this thread just to see what the feeling was regarding the subject of axcidents at sea the problem is you can have a force 3 and the sea sta\te could be that of a force 7 which could be blowing 250 miles away,but in my experience the worst sea state is that of a confused motion ie there has been say a force 5 southeasterly blowing then the wind has changed to a westerly say force 4 or 5 this can make any boat roll a hell of a lot more than it you would normally, you dont have to experience a lot of wind to make the sea unstable .

But somebody some day is going to try and have a go at the no win no fee basis on this subject and if succesfull it will set a completly new precident in the chartering game ,sending insurance premiums soaring thus leaving not many charterboats in operation.

Edited May 2, 2006 by big_cod

[The doctor]

A good few years ago, I seem to remember a skipper in whitby having a problem with an angler who hurt himself on his boat, said skipper was ploughing through a heavy sea at a fair old lick of knots (as was his want), said angler was not feeling too good. After taking a few heavy bangs on a couple of big swells the angler dropped to his hands and knees and started to scrabble about the deck, can't remember if he was being sick at the same time. Skipper after being alerted by the other anglers slowed down and came out to see what the guy was doing. Turns out the chap had a glass eye, and after a particularly hard bang, his eye had shot out of its socket and was somewhere on deck. I seem to remember the angler threatening legal action as the skipper was allegedly not acting in a responsible manner given the conditions, but can't remember if it actually got to court. Your neck of the woods BC and Glenn, can you shed any light on this. I would say it was about 91-92, just after said skipper had got his new boat.

 

Around the same time (give or take a couple of years), a skipper in Bridlington had a party out at the gas rigs, they were having a good day, but the weather changed unexpectedly, and he decided to make for home. Unfortunately he lost his rudder, and had no steering, a local trawler picked up his call for assistance and towed him into brid. Unfortunately just at the pier end the tow parted and the charter boat (now in a heavy swell) got swept down the wrong side (outer) of the pier. She quickly overturned, and all went into the water, most got out quickly but one chap was not so lucky. I don't think he drowned, but had a heart attack in the water, same result though and he lost his life (he was actually wearing waders!!!!!).

 

The skipper went to court (private case brought by the family) where he was cleared of any fault, the judge said he had done everything humanly possible to prevent the accident, but the factors were against him. nevertheless, it destroyed him, and he never really recovered (in terms of charter angling).

 

All in all, experience is everything, chances should not be taken, whether charter boat skipper, private boat owner or shore angler, no fish is worth the loss of life, and when thats all been said you can still never fully account for the unexpected.

 

 

Cheers

 

 

Doc

Edited May 3, 2006 by The doctor

[Elton]

My advice to you Paul is dont ask advice about such things in a forum as all you will get is confused. For matters of Law consult a soliciter. Yes they arent cheap but they know the law better than anyone and they wont guess at an answer.

 

Yes they will, as that's how the law works. Each case, if it goes to court, is treated differently and can be either 'won' or 'lost' for a number of reasons. A solicitor might know the odds a bit better than Joe Public, but it's rarely cut and dry.

[Brian Carragher]

Around the same time (give or take a couple of years), a skipper in Bridlington had a party out at the gas rigs, they were having a good day, but the weather changed unexpectedly, and he decided to make for home. Unfortunately he lost his rudder, and had no steering, a local trawler picked up his call for assistance and towed him into brid. Unfortunately just at the pier end the tow parted and the charter boat (now in a heavy swell) got swept down the wrong side (outer) of the pier. She quickly overturned, and all went into the water, most got out quickly but one chap was not so lucky. I don't think he drowned, but had a heart attack in the water, same result though and he lost his life (he was actually wearing waders!!!!!).

 

Cheers

Doc

 

The fact that someone was wearing waders has no bearing on what happened to the guy in the water and contrary to popular opinion do not drag you under the water. Even when wearing wader, even the old fashioned full rubber type as favoured by boat anglers along this coastline, you still float in the water when wearing them but you must remember the demonstration by Hugh Falkus on how to float correctly

[Fastd]

This thread got me to thinking about my own situation as a private boat owner who takes out non paying friends. I have third party cover but not public liability. It does not mention cover against accidents only cover for removal if sunk and damage to property.

 

 

 

I guess this leaves me open to claims for personal injury in the event of someone falling over and hurting themselves. Time to review the policy methinks and look for something thats not cheep and only provides the minimum cover required to launch, which has been my criteria when looking for insurance.

 

 

 

Dave

[Elton]

This thread got me to thinking about my own situation as a private boat owner who takes out non paying friends. I have third party cover but not public liability. It does not mention cover against accidents only cover for removal if sunk and damage to property.

 

 

 

I guess this leaves me open to claims for personal injury in the event of someone falling over and hurting themselves. Time to review the policy methinks and look for something thats not cheep and only provides the minimum cover required to launch, which has been my criteria when looking for insurance.

 

 

 

Dave

 

Or make them sign a disclaimer