British records increasing .

[Guest 1lastcast]

1last

 

They are genetically different races of fish. You're preferred "guppy" carp are one of about 230 races of carp. Has nothing to do with what they eat.

 

Phone

You are gonna have to run that past me again Phone,

 

I'll make a cup of tea, do u take sugar?

Edited March 20, 2013 by 1lastcast

[Guest 1lastcast]

1last,

 

No, they won't be "bigger" fish. They will reach their genetic potential as programed. For example, the "fastest growing" carp I am familiar with is an Israeli race. However their genetic potential is only about 15 - 20 lbs with a life span of 10 years.

 

You can feed a carp whatever you wish. If the water temperature is below about 50 F for more than 7 months carp will dissapear from the venue.

 

"Fish farm foods" are generally NOT good angler baits. Fish farmers want the most efficient weight gain for the least cost over the long haul. Anglers don't care what bait costs. And, in fact, bait is designed for instant gratification.

 

Phone

Not so sure about that at all, especially regarding water temp, especially now I have converted to Centigrade...and believe me we have had a 18 month winter over here and the the Carp live!! But yes they are a warm water species, and until recently only did well in the warmer south of England.

I think I said fatter, and you are right Carp anglers have had a disregard to what they a piling in, reap what you sow I guess.

[Phone]

1last,

 

Carp (Cyprinus carpio) are kind of like humans. There are different races (strains). New ones are continually being developed for specific purposes. I can be corrected but last I remember there are about 230 races of common carp.

 

Having nothing to do with "what" they eat is meant to remind anglers conditions and genetics also have to be "right". Certainly if NO food is present we can't expect a fish to reach its maximum potential. Equally, if an over abundance of food is present a fish cannot "overcome" its genes.

 

Phone

[Anderoo]

It's a good point about the strains of carp. Most carp stocked for the purposes of angling now are fast growing, short lived, and prone to looking fat - e.g. Simmos. The old Leney strain look totally different, longer, leaner, slower growing and longer living. The old wild carp even more so.

[Phone]

1last,

 

You are not alone in your disbelief of the 50 F statement. It is, however true. (there is some latitude for the "race" issue but not all that much.)

 

At about 50F carp can digest between 5 and 7% of what they consume. Energy is stored in the liver (a very unique organ in common carp) that lays along the spine. At optimum weight the liver can be as much as 15 - 20% of the total weight in the fall. Common carp can survive for 7 months without eating. At some point survival depends on getting more energy than the energy spent.

 

Phone

[Steve Burke]

Steve,

 

Only for you as I consider myself an "expert" and rarely quote sources.

 

Many thanks for that, Phone, I appreciate it.

 

However it's the accepted practice in science for sources to be quoted. This is because there are always different views between scientists, however expert they are. One source says one thing, another says the opposite. So it would be helpful if you always quoted sources for us.

[Steve Burke]

However if we were look at one species (Tench) that has over a short period rocketed in size, it was only in the 80's that the record was c.9lb, and now it double that, and in that period we as anglers have been using great amounts of the new bait, surely then it cannot be climate, genetics, or similar as the change in size of the Tench would have to be over a longer time line? The only answer has to be diet which the body responds to in a shorter period.

 

An interesting point. However, it doesn't explain why tench have also increased so much in weight in waters that aren't fished and therefore don't see any bait.

[Dave H]

There are always exceptions to the rule but not many nowadays. Records use to creep up but as mentioned those sweet toothed fish as in Tench and Carp have hit the roof and that is down to NHV. .

 

But Wingham is an exception as there are few Winghams about sadly .

 

But to say that natural foods etc etc have made a difference to the size of fish over 20 years to such a massive increase is quite a statement.

A Boilies base ingredient is Egg. What do body builders use well it's very much a protein egg diet.

 

 

 

Look at this 'Thing' . I see no beauty in this at all. in fact i find it gross. I don't think there is much natural food in that gut!

 

 

What was quite amusing is that in this chaps log he said to others that the secret to the lake was to target one fish only and put very little but often in. eeeerrr!...

Edited March 20, 2013 by Dave H

[Phone]

Steve,

 

You're welcome. There are an equal number of experts who contend carp can and do "learn". We can't settle of defining "learn". No one believes they can make "either/or" consciously or extract pleasure.

 

The only obvious explaination for the tench question would be water quality. Improved water quality has dramatically increased the records for "blue catfish" in our rivers. You know - I really do believe water quality have improved. Maybe??

 

Phone

[Steve Burke]

The only obvious explaination for the tench question would be water quality. Improved water quality has dramatically increased the records for "blue catfish" in our rivers. You know - I really do believe water quality have improved. Maybe??

 

Phone

 

This would be down to increased nitrate/phosphate levels (Eutrophication). However some might debate whether this improves the water quality!

 

It's come about partly because of enrichment from fertilisers from farming. The time scale certainly fits.

 

It's also worth pointing out that carp grow bigger on the Continent, hence many British carp anglers travelling to France. One of the reasons for them being bigger is likely to be the warmer climate.