Fish welfare - or just OTT

[Phone]

gozzer,

 

What part of angling in not "silly"...?

 

Phone

[chesters1]

gozzer,

 

What part of angling in not "silly"...?

 

Phone

Throwing perfectly good food away has always been silly ,my mum used to smack me for playing with mine(wink)

 

I suppose to some just a post about OTT anything is OTT

 

With anything you have to find out the reason "why" ,it maybe for the welfare of fish or the welfare of doogooders ideas of welfare of fish mixed with the ability of power to push things across.

Several answers...

Ignore rules but live with the consequence

Use your status (if any) to change them

Get many people with little status to change them

Bend them to your advantage

Vote with your feet

Follow them and do as your told

Remove the ones with power over you from power over you

Vote in someone you have power over to do your bidding

 

Look at the committee or the ruling body of your club ,if the majority are carp anglers then anything carp will have precedence over everything else ,if matchmen then their angle will be heavily biased ,generally the common all round angler comes a long way down the list on club priorities

Edited November 3, 2014 by chesters1

[gozzer]

gozzer,

 

What part of angling in not "silly"...?

 

Phone

 

The bits I find not silly, are those that concern the welfare of not only the fish, but their place in a relatively 'natural' setting. The condition of the water, the balance between species, etc.

The things I do find "silly" are the anglers who think that all water is their domain, and they can manipulate the species and stock levels, just to suit their own ends, regardless of any negative impact on anything else, including other anglers!

During my earlier days as a committee member of a club affiliated to a larger association, (this might sound strange to younger anglers, but it worked). We used to have our AGMs as usual where things were thrashed out. Although the association was mainly match orientated, there were lakes, river, and sections of canal that were classed as 'pleasure only' waters. Matches were not allowed at all on these waters, so the pleasure angler always had water to fish. It wasn't the crap water either, there were some excellent stretches of river and lakes in there. This was done to provide good angling for everyone, even though the majority of members were match anglers.

The rules were simple. First it was the standard 'countryside code', because most of the land was leased off farmers etc. The fish welfare rules were mainly common sense, and hardly needed to be written. If a member caught another angler, (member or not), contravening the rules he was reported, either by looking at the yearbook, licence, car reg', or even a description being circulated for future reference. This was mainly for the benefit of the land owner. There were no, "This is a carp water", you can't do that, or "This is a pike water", or any other type of water, except the higher reaches which were mainly trout. They were all 'coarse fish waters', and held a mixed stock, which had reached it's own balance over the years, and which changed as time and conditions dictated.

There's an old saying that I've often quoted in workplace situations, it's been attributed to Douglas Bader.

 

"Rules are for the guidance of wise men, and the obedience of fools", I strongly believe in it.

 

John.

[BobH]

Mat,

A fishery near me is about to change it's rules an insist that all anglers uses Crib/Cradle style unhooking stations rather than a standard mat. Seems a bit OTT to me, I've never had any problems using a mat, and in fact think a mat is a better option for pike as you can straddle them to control them while unhooking, in a cradle it'd be free to thrash about

 

Wondered what you guys thought, is this getting a bit OTT? those things aren't cheap, and I'm not convinced that they will actually improve fish welfare.

 

Or is this something we are going to see more of ?

 

Mat

 

The pictures below are off my Fox Easy Mat and because it's soft and foldable I'm sure it could be used for Pike, I'm of the opinion that most Crip/Cradles would not be suitable for Pike as they are off the ground.

 

But if a Club or Commercial fishery decide that a cradle is needed, the Fox or Chub are I believe the ones to look at.

 

Or of course you could as others have suggested, not fish those venues, which seems a shame to me if you like the venue ?

 

Bob

Edited November 3, 2014 by BobH

[ayjay]

Several answers...

Ignore rules but live with the consequence

Use your status (if any) to change them

Get many people with little status to change them

Bend them to your advantage

Vote with your feet

Follow them and do as your told

Remove the ones with power over you from power over you

Vote in someone you have power over to do your bidding

 

You left out "Find ways around them"

 

One club, one particular lake, banned floating baits. Problems with inattentive anglers, ducks, and a prolific public presence.

 

It's my favourite method, (for carp), the lake is close to home and I fished it once or twice every summer, with floaters.

 

So I fished luncheon meat on a bait-caster rig - completely kosher as the bait didn't float - the rule said no floating baits, not no surface baits.

 

Cradles? Completely OTT.

 

I carry an unhooking mat, it makes a useful cushion on my chair, but can be unclipped for fishy usage when necessary - not often.

[Steve Burke]

I'm ever so busy at the moment so to save time here's what I posted on a previous topic:

 

"I hadn't intended getting involved in this discussion, but as a "professional" running my own fisheries I feel obliged to comment as I insist on unhooking mats.

 

Some swims at Wingham need an unhooking mat purely because they contain stones, some of which are sharp. In other swims you could probably get away with not using an unhooking mat most of the time. And I accept that many fish can be unhooked in the water.

 

Most anglers are very sensible; I'd certainly like to think that Wingham members are, as are their guests even though I haven't vetted the latter. However every fishery manager has to legislate for the lowest common denominator. It takes just one rotten apple..........

 

I therefore insist on all members having an unhooking mat. Most of the fishing at Wingham is session angling with a lot of gear being carried so the extra weight/bulk of an unhooking mat is minimal in comparison.

 

I'd add that when roving, I do the same as Vagabond and use my unhooking mat as a seat. But I still take one."

 

I also posted the following reply to Gozzer:

 

"gozzer, on 12 Jun 2013 - 13:20, said:

 

I'm glad you did jump into the thread Steve, and I understand why you insist on anglers having a mat with them, especially at Wingham.

Just out of interest, and it might be a daft question, but if you saw an angler unhooking a fish, (say a 6lb tench), in the net spread between his legs, then return it straight to the water, what would be your reaction?

 

I take a dim view of any breach of the rules. It's not up to the member to decide but the fishery manager. Any other policy simply leads to anarchy, as where do you draw the line?

 

Of course, having said that, every case has to be looked at individually. If no harm is likely to be done then no action would be taken.

 

The same applies to my team of bailiffs. They're all experienced and sensible and know when to take action and when not to.

 

What is annoying is the situation we've probably all come across when a bailiff interprets the rules very rigidly.

 

Even worse is when there's one set of rules for members, a different set for bailiffs and the owner. At Wingham we all abide by the same rules."

 

 

[chesters1]

You left out "Find ways around them"

 

One club, one particular lake, banned floating baits. Problems with inattentive anglers, ducks, and a prolific public presence.

 

It's my favourite method, (for carp), the lake is close to home and I fished it once or twice every summer, with floaters.

 

So I fished luncheon meat on a bait-caster rig - completely kosher as the bait didn't float - the rule said no floating baits, not no surface baits.

 

Cradles? Completely OTT.

 

I carry an unhooking mat, it makes a useful cushion on my chair, but can be unclipped for fishy usage when necessary - not often.

Bend them is near enough Edited November 3, 2014 by chesters1

[ayjay]

Bend them is near enough

I don't consider that to be bending the rule at all: circumventing their intention maybe, but that's down to the fool(s) that wrote it who left the gaping hole, the rule simply said no floating baits - my bait didn't float, it was suspended on the surface. No bending necessary.

[stivestackle]

I do agree a lot of this fish care is at times OTT. Trouble is you have to legislate for the lowest denominator. What I call a cradle is the type thats a mini bedchair rather than a mat with sides which seems a lot of hassle to set up. I recall reading of one lake that banned the cot type of mat as anglers were leaving the fish in the mat/sling for way too long as they felt the fish was safe! Never mind it was out of water eh?

The new Fox Easimat is great though as its not got the bulk of some of the others and is super speedy to set up.

 

Like a previous poster said I'm off pike fishing this weekend and a basic mat is all that is required when travelling light.

A confident angler can handle a fish well on any type of mat but a poor angler will make a hash of it even with the best mat.

Edited November 4, 2014 by stivestackle

[Steve Burke]

The new Fox Easimat is great though as its not got the bulk of some of the others and is super speedy to set up.

 

 

The new Fox Easimat is great though as its not got the bulk of some of the others and is super speedy to set up.

 

Now, that does look interesting! There's a video about it at http://www.foxint.com/catalogues-products.php?section=48&product=2748.

 

I do wish though that tackle companies would do mats with closed cell foam. The soft foam can take in water if the outer cover gets pierced, which of course is much more likely with double trebles when piking.

Edited November 4, 2014 by Steve Burke