E U. Should we stay or should we leave.

[barry luxton]

Here is tusk with his very poor attempt to re write history claiming that the e u countries had made sacrifices with regards to how much the broken e u was to change to placate Cameron's wants and needs for the e u political change.

 

really mr tusk.

 

http://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/870358/Brexit-news-Donald-Tusk-Jean-Claude-Juncker-update-EU-Parliament-Britain-UK

[Sportsman]

Quoting complete tripe from the Express day after day does not strengthen your case

[Huge_Vitae]

Ignoring the media, as I often do for so many reasons, I listened to Tusk speaking in the EU Parliment today, calling for (the 26) to remain united in the brexit negotiations adding with a united approach, there will be three outcomes, a good deal (for the EU?), no deal or no brexit. So there is the EU's position and if anyone would like to tell me that is a fair or good position then go ahead, there are whispers of Legal Enforcement to turn the EU to make them comply with their own charters and rules in this regard.

 

From a democratic point of view the thought of the EU overturning or more correctly influencing a change beggars belief.

 

I know some will be jumping for joy as stated before, I have always thought this would be the outcome, but to achieve the aim in such a manner will send far reaching ripples that will effect this Country for ages, obviously the Govt. will fall (again some will be glad) and the outcome, well, the permutations are endless.

[Sportsman]

A good deal would be a good deal for the EU and the UK. If it were not a good deal for both then it would not be a good deal for either.

No deal is what many brexit extremists want and are asking for (farage et al)

No brexit is very unlikely, but still possible.

It should be remembered that it was the UK that instigated this and the UK that wants it so expecting the remaining countries in the EU to bend over backwards or make sacrifices to appease the UK was never going to happen.

My wish has always been in the UK to be successful whatever happens, my livelihood depends on it.

I have to say that I have very little (OK, no) confidence in the clueless individuals that make up the UK's negotiating team, or government for that matter.

[Huge_Vitae]

Not expecting anyone to bend over backwards, and to use your other words such as 'instigate' is crass, it Is and remains the right of any Country to leave, there are regulations and rules within the charter to allow this, the current negotiations are akin to seeking to purchase a house from a seller who is intent on negotiating a price for every socket, switch or light fitting room by room.

 

Yes, 'some' want a just leave exit, long ago the House of Lords legal ruling was the UK was liable to pay zero on departing, and I can see lots of reasons why this would be attractive especially where some negotiations are taking us, as a for instance The Eire, NI border, it would be simple to say "The UK will not put in any border controls, if they exist they will be put there by the EU! Another would be access to UK territorial waters, Spain and the rest cannot fish in them, but if they want the fish they can buy them from UK boats.

 

What I find more interesting and is why I listen to these things 'live' is the parts that are said but not reported, are you aware Sporty that there is an intention to replace a number of MEP's with MEP's of no territorial interests, ie. European Party MP's

 

As for trusting any politician! Well, sorry to say it has been an awful long time since I had faith in the future with any of them, certainly since 1994. I liken voting to a long journey that has to be made, on that journey there is a single rest stop, everytime you get to this place the menu is crap and disgusting but you are hungry and pick the thing which is less nauseating, hoping the next time you visit the menu will change.

 

The fear I have with the EU, and nothing I read alleviates that fear, is what it will become, and that one journey pulling into the rest stop there is a single item on the menu, not only that but there are people there to make sure you eat it.

[chesters1]

Not expecting anyone to bend over backwards, and to use your other words such as 'instigate' is crass, it Is and remains the right of any Country to leave, there are regulations and rules within the charter to allow this, the current negotiations are akin to seeking to purchase a house from a seller who is intent on negotiating a price for every socket, switch or light fitting room by room.

 

Yes, 'some' want a just leave exit, long ago the House of Lords legal ruling was the UK was liable to pay zero on departing, and I can see lots of reasons why this would be attractive especially where some negotiations are taking us, as a for instance The Eire, NI border, it would be simple to say "The UK will not put in any border controls, if they exist they will be put there by the EU! Another would be access to UK territorial waters, Spain and the rest cannot fish in them, but if they want the fish they can buy them from UK boats.

 

What I find more interesting and is why I listen to these things 'live' is the parts that are said but not reported, are you aware Sporty that there is an intention to replace a number of MEP's with MEP's of no territorial interests, ie. European Party MP's

 

As for trusting any politician! Well, sorry to say it has been an awful long time since I had faith in the future with any of them, certainly since 1994. I liken voting to a long journey that has to be made, on that journey there is a single rest stop, everytime you get to this place the menu is crap and disgusting but you are hungry and pick the thing which is less nauseating, hoping the next time you visit the menu will change.

 

The fear I have with the EU, and nothing I read alleviates that fear, is what it will become, and that one journey pulling into the rest stop there is a single item on the menu, not only that but there are people there to make sure you eat it.

In my road trip i would not stop at the resturant and starve or eat sarnies ,if you vote for a corrupt system you encourage a corrupt system (or menu in this case)

Wheres the negotiator in the guise of gordon ramsey ? Tusk go **** yourself have you seen the **** in this fridge!

[barry luxton]

Sportsman, on 24 Oct 2017 - 12:04, said:

Quoting complete tripe from the Express day after day does not strengthen your case

absolute cobblers from you, the last two quotes came direct from e u manderin's gobs. The only shiet you may have read has come direct from them. And here's another newspaper countering the same shiet that big cod has salivated over.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-eu-theresa-may-dinner-leaks-juncker-brussels-undermine-talks-uk-leave-deals-a8015081.html

 

note cory trolling from behind the parapet. perhaps he hasn't got anything positive to say about the u k with regards the u k leaving the e u's political tit, wondering if he still wants to suckle.

[Sportsman]

Strange how you brexiteers make everything so personal and insulting.

All of the bullying and name calling coming from one direction.

If you can't discuss civilly, I will leave you to it.

Good luck

[barry luxton]

 

Sportsman, on 24 Oct 2017 - 17:16, said:

Strange how you brexiteers make everything so personal and insulting.

All of the bullying and name calling coming from one direction.

If you can't discuss civilly, I will leave you to it.

Good luck

 

 

Na to me the issue you have is countering the facts. it's so easy to dismiss your comments as you have nothing worthy.

 

Bullying did you say, go direct that to the intransigent e u manderins who are clearly scoring an own goal. Go read tusk's comments again. They are starting to realise just how much they are shooting themselves in the foot by taking the 'p' out of the u k.

 

off you go don't sulk too much.

 

Errrmmm name calling you say? Quote you:

The man is a proven serial liar.

He lies about everything. He lied about what he said to the widow.

He is not fit to hold the office on that basis alone.

It may well be that in the future, the special counsel will find something more.

I look forward to it.

The man isan a'hole on just about every level and has been all of his life.

Edited October 24, 2017 by barry luxton

[Huge_Vitae]

In my road trip i would not stop at the resturant and starve or eat sarnies ,if you vote for a corrupt system you encourage a corrupt system (or menu in this case)

Wheres the negotiator in the guise of gordon ramsey ? Tusk go **** yourself have you seen the **** in this fridge!

Said it before Chesters but for clarity I will repeat myself and say I respect the right of anyone to withhold their vote. My only issue with that non vote is when people decide to add those numbers together to support their cause as there is no basis to assume the intention of anyone who does not actually vote.

 

That being said, the sad part of it is that it only takes one person to cast a vote and the corrupt system continues, in the case under discussion, those people who gain monetary or pecuniary advantage from the rest stop and use it continue its existence.

 

Case in point, almost the entire of the U.K. wants, requires or demands progress in the brexit negotiations as, we are all aware, markets are reacting to the uncertainty so that is obvious, once again this delay on time sensitive discussions plays into the hands of the two extreme sides. So what happens when there is a vote in the EU Parliment to progress the talks on to the next stage? Twenty four UK MEP's vote against the talks progressing to the next stage! Before anybody comments that the progression would have been defeated anyway, I don't consider there has ever been demonstrated a better example of an elected representative putting their own interests above the interests of their own voters. I have not had the time to analyse each constituency's vote compared to how their supposed representative voted but do not think this matters.

 

Disgusting behaviour which even shocked JC and Angela Rayner in the house, but perhaps those twenty four are after one of the new jobs as non territorial aligned MEP's that are planned to hold the majority vote in support of the EU itself. Or to put it in simpler terms twenty four MEP's say "**** you Jack, I'm alright, pull up the ladder."

Edited October 24, 2017 by Huge_Vitae