barbel at makins

[poledark]

Not being an expert in these matters, I have to ask the question as to whether the ability/environment to enable breeding to take place would make a fish "unhappy". Not having to fight floods every time it rains, having still places where they can simply relax and maybe "chill out"..a constant supply of clean well oxygenated water with no sewage (albeit treated) pumped in on a daily basis.

 

A fish could be "happy" living like that I think.

 

There is no way I would consider stocking a commercial match type lake with them though.

 

Den

[Sportsman]

Just out of interest, when does a stocked day ticket water become a commercial muddy puddle.

Is it the size of the water or the stocking density.

[Steve Walker]

Just out of interest, when does a stocked day ticket water become a commercial muddy puddle.

Is it the size of the water or the stocking density.

 

Stocking density, I'd say. Top left is a fairly heavily stocked day ticket water, bottom left is a muddy carp puddle, centre is a fairly natural carp/tench water for club members, right is a carp syndicate lake.

 

[gozzer]

The "make room for more carp" cynics weren't wrong actually...

 

]cobra, just don't ask about tactics for stillwater gudgeon, as all hell will break loose .

 

No cynicism on my part Dave, just stating the obvious.

Oh and I've seen gudgeon spawn in stillwaters, so any advise about tactics will be given willingly .

 

The misconception about this type of water is that they are just match waters. They started out like that, but now they are the norm' for many new, (and not so new) anglers.

I have a fear that in the not too distant future, they will be the only waters available to many anglers. The rest being taken over by syndicates and small private clubs. I've said on here many times that some of the the association waters are turning that way already.

One of the reasons that this is a subject very close to my heart is that it is coming home to me in a big way. With the present economic climate being as it is, I think I might have to get rid of my car.

If that happens, then the only viable waters available to me will be the overstocked commercial type. Since I have said many times that if that happened then I would hang up my rods, then that is what I will do, until circumstances permit otherwise.

I couldn't get any pleasure out of fishing these places, and since I fish for enjoyment it would be pointless.

 

Steve's picture clearly shows the 'muddy hole' type of fishery, but they don't all look like that. The gravel pits I mentioned look pretty clear, but under the water they are teeming with too many fish for the size of water. The nature of the bottom just doesn't allow it to become that colour.

 

John.

 

PS. I have a small apology to make to Den. The waters I mentioned in our last discussion as being about 30 acres are in fact nearer to 15 acres, (I'm rubbish at guessing the size of a water). It doesn't alter the fact that stocking these waters with over a thousand small carp ruined them, in fact it makes it worse.

Edited July 3, 2008 by gozzer

[Kappa]

Or is it to satisfy the curious pleasure angler who cannot be bothered to fish for the species in it's preferred environment?

 

i suspect your comment regarding the 25lb gravel pit barbel is 'tongue in cheek'

i hope so, but if it did come to that then the 'record' would not be recognised, because there is stil some pockets of common sense in our sport, but for how long?

 

.... but to deny a chub or barbel of it's basic requirement...running water is poor, for the sake of the darts fraternity.

I think it is unfair to say anglers who fish Makins etc can't be bothered to fish for Barbel in rivers. Who is to say how much experience they have on rivers? Don't forget that many wouldn't know where to go or how to approach rivers!

 

I think a record would have to be supported where ever it came from, you can’t not recognise it because it’s from a lake.

 

The last bit is the whole point of my post, what I'm wondering is if running water is actually a requirement, certainly it is for spawning but certainly not for life. Chub seem to be more than happy in gravel pits near me!

 

Rich

[BoldBear]

I didn't realise how lucky I was, as I only know of one or two commercial waters about 10 to 15 miles from me, and the only people who seem to fish them are matchmen. I only know about them from my match fishing days. Im surrounded by really good club waters from the Grand Union Canal through to Estate lakes, Gravel Pits, Barbel Rivers etc. so there is no reason for anyone to fish these overstocked commercial carp puddles in my area. I really feel sorry for the people who live in areas where good waters are not so common and where visiting an unnatural overstocked commercial pool is all they have available to them where the pegs are too close together so they can get more anglers in and the pegs are neatly set out and the grass is neatly mown and the waters are a uniform width for the pole anglers and the fish gulp down everything that you chuck at them because they are nearly always hungry, and you have to use the fisheries own bait etc. etc. and the anglers think that watercraft is something they float on in the navy.

And when someone decides to stock fish like Barbel in them as well it makes me feel sick.

 

I think I would give up fishing and play Golf more often if I lived in one of these deprived areas.

Edited July 3, 2008 by BoldBear

[Guest Rabbit]

Not being an expert in these matters, I have to ask the question as to whether the ability/environment to enable breeding to take place would make a fish "unhappy". Not having to fight floods every time it rains, having still places where they can simply relax and maybe "chill out"..a constant supply of clean well oxygenated water with no sewage (albeit treated) pumped in on a daily basis.

 

A fish could be "happy" living like that I think.

 

There is no way I would consider stocking a commercial match type lake with them though.

 

Den

 

Happy? Come off it Den you old leg puller. The only reason ANY being is on Earth is to breed, that is the reason for al creatures existence, to deny any creature a suitable habitat to do so will not make them 'happy' Thus barbus barbus will not be happy Den, in fact he will cease to be a barbel.

i am sure it is better the barbel takes it's chances with flood and sewage, after al he is done well so far.

[Guest Rabbit]

I think it is unfair to say anglers who fish Makins etc can't be bothered to fish for Barbel in rivers. Who is to say how much experience they have on rivers? Don't forget that many wouldn't know where to go or how to approach rivers!

 

I think a record would have to be supported where ever it came from, you can’t not recognise it because it’s from a lake.

 

The last bit is the whole point of my post, what I'm wondering is if running water is actually a requirement, certainly it is for spawning but certainly not for life. Chub seem to be more than happy in gravel pits near me!

 

Rich

 

Just her do you want to go with your argument Rich? You surely cannot defend stocking barbel in a still water. of all the species that swim in our waters the barbel is unique in that it is perfectly adapted for flowing waters. why then would you want to pur them in an alien environment?

 

As far as anyone claiming a still water record barbel then I would feel sorry for the guy, believe me it would not be recognised and would be worthless. Just as the carp record is worthless along with the rainbow trout. Worthless in an angling sense but not so in the greedy lucrative world of tackle / venue revenue that the more gullible amongst us actually are influenced by.

 

Chub do well in gravel pits, true, but their body shape is similar to most other of our coarse fish.

 

The Barbel is adapted ONLY for Rivers.

 

It can only spawn in rivers.

 

Surely you cannot argue with that...can you?.

[bluezulu]

makins is far from being the only pool in the midlands area that stocks still water barbel. i have caught dozens of em from such venues as the riddings and jam factory. no idea if the fish are happy as i have never talked to one, but they look healthy enough to me and fight just as hard as their river cousins .

[Brian Carragher]

The Barbel is adapted ONLY for Rivers.

 

It can only spawn in rivers.

 

Surely you cannot argue with that...can you?.

 

I think I can

 

There is enough documented evidence from those commercials that have stocked barbel to prove the existence of BABY barbel in their waters, wonder where they came from, did the magic fairy come down in the middle of the night and sprinkle fairy dust to produce those little barble that anglers catch or do you think its possible that (ssh keep it quiet now) the resident barbel in those commercials have actually spawned and are happy(whatever thats supposed to mean)

 

Try not to give fish human traits and treat them for what they really are, just fish with no sense of conscience or thinking ability other than that of feeding and swimming, reflex creatures without souls