Pike Anglers: Compulsory Courses?

[Dick Dastardly]

I was going there mentally too. it seems that within angling there are lots of those who welcome being dominated (perhaps they feel safe with somone else telling then how to fish). perhaps gimp masks and realtree will become au rigour?

 

 

Oh God I hope so!!!

[Dick Dastardly]

Am I reading you right Budgie? It sounds like you are in favour of angling 'exams' before being allowed to fish.

 

John.

 

John I will try and answer this as best and as honestly as I can.If it seems like I'm sitting on the fence or skirting around some issues I'm not! its merely that I have very conflicting views on this.Ok well here goes.

 

If I was the manager of my own water ever again then for that water my answer would be yes.I would therefore by the fact that Ive introduced such a requirement ensure that I provided instruction/help etc as much as I could for free to help guys do things the way I wanted them to (at this stage lets just accept that it immaterial if my way is right or wrong,its just the way I want it and as its my water that's my prerogative). Basically I would insist on the standard but ensure that it was easy enough for people to qualify.The whole thing being a mutually beneficial thing rather than just an obstacle/bar to people.

 

Across the board on all waters/nationally (like in Germany) Yes I would like to see it but sadly I dont think it would be possible as the potential bad things about it (people taking advantage and seeing it as a way to make a buck,it possibly putting off/making it harder to start for youngsters/newcomers,power merchants seizing it as a form of "control" etc etc) are far to likely to exceed the benefits.So as such I would have to unfortunately say no.

 

My (possibly idealistic) view is that it would be of great benefit to all and once this was seen it would then be accepted as normal and spread..........its just getting people to "suck it and see" in the first place that would be so hard as we have all become very wary and cynical of such things by what we have seen in the past.

[Phone]

BUDGIE,

 

Thanks for the answers. Your attention to the details others question gives a full account and says volumns of your dedication to good angling practices (not just pike). I would not in a million years start a pike thread. I know so little.

 

Please do not take my lightheartedness as any sort of belittllement - simply ignorance over here.

 

It makes me frightened to death to offer a British guest a go a knocking 40 lbs of zander in the head for a "fish fry". Not sure now exactly who or what might get cooked.

 

Phone

Edit: Also, will someone put up the current "totals" in the poll? Since I can't, in all honesty, vote I have no idea how the pole is running.

Edited January 19, 2012 by Phone

[Dick Dastardly]

Brits in general dont seem to like being shown what to do let alone told! Indeed why guiding has never really taken off in this country like it has even in Europe let alone the US! Many anglers be they carp,sea or fly will spend astronomic amounts on buying a rod that (well they think) will cast further..............but even if free wouldn't take lessons on how to use it!

 

Maybe my view is somewhat biased by my life experience? As a young lad in the Army if I wanted/or they needed me to do something (be it drive a vehicle,jump from a plane,shoot a new weapon,use a piece of equipment or whatever!) I would receive formal instruction,practice then be tested to make sure I was competent before being able to go it alone.It was normal procedure and to me both then and indeed still now perfectly understandable! This doesn't seem to cover every thing out here in the real world and I fail to understand!!! An example-

 

Before I was allowed to tow a trailer I was taught how to manoeuvre it,hook it up,maintain it etc etc then tested then if I was up to standard of I went................but in civvy street there is no such need and indeed people would bulk (as indeed it seems they have here to the idea of being "taught" and "tested" something to do with fishing) at the mere though of having to be taught how to reverse a trailer..................and how many people do we see out there with great big FO trailers and caravans who ain't got a clue! They block the road struggle to manoeuvre them by hand etc etc!

 

When I do something I dont want to look like an idiot! I want to learn to do it right! I find no shame at all in not knowing and some one else teaching ....makes perfect sense to me! So why is it? or am I just institutionalised!

[gozzer]

John I will try and answer this as best and as honestly as I can.If it seems like I'm sitting on the fence or skirting around some issues I'm not! its merely that I have very conflicting views on this.Ok well here goes.

 

If I was the manager of my own water ever again then for that water my answer would be yes.I would therefore by the fact that Ive introduced such a requirement ensure that I provided instruction/help etc as much as I could for free to help guys do things the way I wanted them to (at this stage lets just accept that it immaterial if my way is right or wrong,its just the way I want it and as its my water that's my prerogative). Basically I would insist on the standard but ensure that it was easy enough for people to qualify.The whole thing being a mutually beneficial thing rather than just an obstacle/bar to people.

 

Across the board on all waters/nationally (like in Germany) Yes I would like to see it but sadly I dont think it would be possible as the potential bad things about it (people taking advantage and seeing it as a way to make a buck,it possibly putting off/making it harder to start for youngsters/newcomers,power merchants seizing it as a form of "control" etc etc) are far to likely to exceed the benefits.So as such I would have to unfortunately say no.

 

My (possibly idealistic) view is that it would be of great benefit to all and once this was seen it would then be accepted as normal and spread..........its just getting people to "suck it and see" in the first place that would be so hard as we have all become very wary and cynical of such things by what we have seen in the past.

 

I agree that if you/anyone owned a water, then you/they are free to do as they wish. It's one of the reasons that I refuse to fish many of the 'commercial' type waters, (apart from the carp), I don't like too many rules governing my angling, it takes a lot of the 'magic' out of it.

Maybe I'm the one being idealistic, but I fish as a way of getting away from such things. This may sound strange (especially to Emma), because I have fished club/association waters all my life, but the rules that governed the waters were, (IMO), mostly the common sense ones, such as respecting the crops/livestock/land, etc of the person we leased the water from. The handling of the fish was, (in my mind), second nature, and a natural, basic part of catching fish. Sure I was lucky to have been brought up in an angling family/environment, but some of the stuff I was taught, didn't feel right to me, and I questioned it, and changed what I thought was wrong. I will always offer to help anyone if I can, but it's up to them whether they take advantage of that offer. I will also take any advice, but reserve the right to disagree with anything I think is wrong.

As to a national standard required to obtain a licence, you're right, it wouldn't work. Angling is too diverse, and different groups would argue about the 'standard' required.

 

Another thought. Who do you think the powers that be would turn to for advice on what should go into such a scheme? Why none other than our national body that represents/governs the whole of angling. And wouldn't they just love it?

 

John.

[Phone]

Gozzer,

 

Let me answer your question from my view. It is USER driven over here. I would no more think of "piking" without a guide than I would trying to fly an airplane. Culturally for angling, we are "into" expert amature relationships.

 

The problem for BUDGIES dream (at least over here) is that there are as many bogus trainers and there are trainees.

Phone

[Rusty]

Out of interest has any one voted NO who does not fish for Pike?

 

I haven't voted but as a non-piker I'd probably regard the 'training' as something which allows me to go solo piking rather than something which prevents it. I've seen JV44 unhook countless pike but I've yet to handle one and do it myself, if I suddenly got the urge to spend a day fishing for them why wouldn't I choose a venue which showed me what to do? After all, if I caught one accidentally I'd seek help.

 

I just about coped with this accidental capture but it was a stressful experience;

 

[Vagabond]

When I do something I dont want to look like an idiot! I want to learn to do it right! I find no shame at all in not knowing and some one else teaching ....makes perfect sense to me! .....or am I just institutionalised ?

 

So true, and yet......

 

When I taught Oceanography, there was an experiment set for the first-year students that involved (amongst many other things) the use of a micrometer.

 

The first time I ran the lab I offered to give a quick demo on the side bench to anyone not familiar with how micrometers work.

 

I was surrounded with lady students. "Oh, well" I thought, "this must be because I am a handsome young man"

 

However, as the experiment progressed, it became obvious that 90% of the male students had no idea how to use a micrometer, but there was something in the male ego that prevented them admitting it.

 

Ever afterwards, I briefed the whole lab, blokes and blokesses, on the use of a micrometer, noting the bored and supercilious expressions of the male students who were trying to convey that I was preaching to the converted.

 

I've seen the same happen on a charter boat - the ladies listen carefully to what the skipper says about rigs and methods, do as he says, and (with a good skipper) do rather well. Those blokes who "know it all" very often finish up with little to show.

 

Institutionalised ? Dunno Budgie, but during my National Service I was quite impressed by the way the services taught things.

 

Loved the opening phrase on how to strip a Bren gun "All yer do is..........

[Emma two]

I agree entirely.

Can I just point out though that it isn't only carp anglers who do it.

 

 

I know, I have seen (and heard snoring) of 'pikers' doing it too...mow that is indefensable. far more so than, not using unhooking mats or the right tools.

 

Le them go camping if they must, let them call their tents 'bivvies' but leave the fishing until awake.

[Anderoo]

I know, I have seen (and heard snoring) of 'pikers' doing it too...mow that is indefensable. far more so than, not using unhooking mats or the right tools.

 

Le them go camping if they must, let them call their tents 'bivvies' but leave the fishing until awake.

 

Absolutely right, and I'm sure a lot of it does go on when some anglers swap their boilies in the summer for herrings in the winter, and through simple ignorance think that everything else stays the same. What you are arguing against is exactly what would teach them that isn't the case!

 

Arguing against night fishing for other species just shows a lack of knowledge about what can be very complex and valid forms of fishing. I'd be happy to go into this in depth if you want to start a different topic.