Yet Another Angler Trying To Ban Livebaiting

[watatoad]

Don't think that it can't or won't happen

 

http://pacnews.blogspot.com/2007/03/liveba...n-scotland.html

 

Thanks for the info Sportsman.

 

So the answer is simple, problem caused by those who were breaking the law in the first place...

 

Don't kid yourselves that banning livebaiting will stop those who already break the laws / rules / regulations from breaking yet another new law.

 

What it will do however is turn a lot of legal and law abiding anglers away from Pike fishing which will cause a loss of revenue to tackle manufacturers, dealers and some regions of this country. Not a great idea in times of high job losses and high unemployment, especially so when many are trying to survive and regions are trying to increase money coming into their areas.

[Sportsman]

There has been an immense amount of nonsense talked on this subject. Every time someone mentions it, the subject of Ruffe in Loch Lomond is dragged up. This garbage has been spouted for so long that people think it is true.

Couple of points:

 

Do you use Ruffe as livebait?

Does anyone you know use Ruffe as livebait?

In the history of the world has anyone ever used Ruffe as livebait?

Is Ruffe such a fantastic livebait that anglers would go to the not inconsiderable trouble of carting them all the way to Scotland, and if so, why aren't they found in all of the other Scottish Pike lochs?

Have you seen the size of Loch Lomond?

What do you think the odds are that half a dozen Ruffe, released from a piker's bucket would ever see each other again, let alone get down and dirty often enough to produce a viable breeding population.

 

We have a similar situation with Roach in Loch Tay. Their presence has been blamed on piker's live baits.

The reality is that many many years ago Roach were stocked into the Tay around Perth Harbour to give Southern dock workers a bit of fishing they recognised. Roach are now found throughout the Tay system and it has nothing to do with Pike live bait.

 

I remember a few years ago having a long running argument on AN with Bruce Sandison about Pike in Scottish Lochs. He maintained that Pike did not occur naturally in Highland lochs and had all been stocked by Southern Pike anglers.

Now apart from the stupidity of believing that if someone wanted to stock a lake for his own amusement he would do it 500 miles away from where he lived, which makes a fishing outing a touch inconvenient, I have a book written, at the time, about very successful Pike Angling in Highland lochs before 1750

 

Unfortunately most people responsible for spreading such inaccurate rubbish are anglers, and the end result is a ban based on such nonsense.

I will bet anyone on here that livebaiting for Pike will be illegal in the UK within 10 Years,

[Dick Dastardly]

Sadly I think you are right Dave.I say sadly not because it will affect mine or most other live baiting pikers fishing! we will all carry on regardless with very little chance of being caught (maybe we should start trans locating EA bailiffs in the hope they might establish viable breeding populations?......we might see the odd one or two then?

 

I say sadly because it will just be another example of Angling (dis) Unitiy in practice and another step down that slippery path when one day all anglers regardless of their methods,bait or chosen species will be having to fish constantly looking over their shoulder.

 

On the Scottish pike front I must admit to having read several accounts of pike being transported by English to stock waters on their Scottish "Sporting Estates" but I to find it a bit hard to believe that this was how pike first got into all of the waters.

[watatoad]

Sadly I think you are right Dave.I say sadly not because it will affect mine or most other live baiting pikers fishing! we will all carry on regardless with very little chance of being caught (maybe we should start trans locating EA bailiffs in the hope they might establish viable breeding populations?......we might see the odd one or two then?

 

I say sadly because it will just be another example of Angling (dis) Unitiy in practice and another step down that slippery path when one day all anglers regardless of their methods,bait or chosen species will be having to fish constantly looking over their shoulder.

 

On the Scottish pike front I must admit to having read several accounts of pike being transported by English to stock waters on their Scottish "Sporting Estates" but I to find it a bit hard to believe that this was how pike first got into all of the waters.

 

I have fished for almost 58 years and I have never had my license checked nor have I ever been approached by a bailiff. Since 1994 I have suffered from Multiple Sclerosis and since 1998 two major heart attack and an several cardiac arrests, leaving me with just 29% of my heart working have severely limited the venues I can fish at. So I fish within very easy walking distance of car parking areas and usually but not always within the confines of a town boundary so there is no excuse for me never being approaching by bailiffs to check on the legality of my fishing. Yet nobody ever has.

 

I am not an aggressive looking person...hehehe a average sized 60 odd year old man with a few extra pounds...So do I look so innocent and trustworthy that the bailiffs assume from a distance that I am o.k. or do they think poor old codger maybe he cant afford a license we'll leave him be.

 

Sometimes my wife accompanies me, sometimes my son, sometimes some of my sons friends, sometimes I am alone, sometimes I have a friend with me.

 

I have always assumed that the various bailiffs are far more busy with pollution and serious problems to deal with and to worry about a few people fishing and I still believe that the bailiffs are too few on the ground, they must be considerably overworked and have far more important work and urgent work to worry about. Than the possibility of the occasional angler who may not have a rod license.

 

I have chatted to a couple of bailiffs over the years but none have ever wanted to check on my license. I did not even know they were bailiffs until during conversations it came up because of their most excellent knowledge of the waters I was fishing.

Edited May 16, 2010 by watatoad

[Worms]

A livebait ban would also of course be easier to impose if a complete taking of coarse fish ban was imposed. ......except for one small pike of course. The lack of livebaits would (in the view of the powers that be) mean that no pike were being caught and....no need for that single small jack to be taken for the table!

 

Result? well a complete ban on taking any coarse fish for any reason and just a tiny step from banning angling completely.

 

As the proposed legislation regarding the ban on taking coarse fish and eels hasn't been implemented yet due to er, shall we say, some minor political hiccups! I strongly recommend that as many people as possible write to our new leaders (!) and put as much weight against the coarse fish ban? I have been busy in this area when all has gone quiet and our current leaders claim to be more sympathetic to (real) anglers than the previous shower. Come on it's not too late, get those letters off now!

Edited May 17, 2010 by Worms

[Vagabond]

Don't think that it can't or won't happen

 

http://pacnews.blogspot.com/2007/03/liveba...n-scotland.html

 

 

From that link

 

During the debate, Tory MSP Jamie McGrigor told the Edinburgh Parliament:

 

"I would support the minister if she were to introduce a Danish-style ban on live bait by banning the use of live bait that had not been caught on the same day and in the same waterway that is being fished......

 

"However, I worry that, in outlawing completely the use of live bait, we may be using a sledgehammer to crack a nut.....

 

"In my view, the Parliament should do all that it can to further the growth of coarse angling generally and pike fishing specifically.

 

 

 

But Green MSP Ealeanor Scott said:

"I not believe that using live fish as bait is acceptable nowadays.

 

 

Deputy Environment Minister Sarah Boyack, who steered the bill through the Scottish Parliament, said: "Those who wish to fish for predatory fish such as pike want no ban, whereas those who fish for other fish want a ban.

 

ie some politicians see (or pretend to see) anglers as divided into two camps - pikefishers and the rest

 

 

 

In the end, just 11 Tory MPs backed the amendment. (ie to allow livebaiting with fish caught that day on the spot)

Eighty, from all other parties, voted against.

 

So who did you vote for in the recent election?

Edited May 17, 2010 by Vagabond

[Andy Macfarlane]

On the Scottish pike front I must admit to having read several accounts of pike being transported by English to stock waters on their Scottish "Sporting Estates" but I to find it a bit hard to believe that this was how pike first got into all of the waters.

 

I thought pike were a remnant from retreating ice and meltwater from the last (or previous) ice-age. Just about everywhere else on the same latitude has pike.

[watatoad]

I thought pike were a remnant from retreating ice and meltwater from the last (or previous) ice-age. Just about everywhere else on the same latitude has pike.

 

:bigemo_harabe_net-163: Funny man...

 

Do you really expect those who have a different agenda to admit to what is considered by many to be a scientific fact as is does not suit their aims and agenda. No chance they will lie and twist and try to disguise facts in an attempt (often Successful) to get their own requirements through. No they throw up false areas which you have to discredit or argue about, they throw up smokescreens to disguise facts, they discredit those who oppose their aims, they twist facts more than a dodgy car dealer.

 

If you want to know how to defeat them don't look at open forums as you won't find the answer in an open forum... :bigemo_harabe_net-163: ...You need to P.M. some crazy or other...hehehe

[Andy Macfarlane]

It wasn't that funny Toad but I'm glad it appealed to your sense of humour on some level.

[HERUTILUS]

The real irony is that he is one of the proprietors of Predator Angling Center - Kiddlington, Oxon a tackle shop that claims to cater for the pike angler! When a very experienced mate of mine from the PAC contacted him reference these comments he replied ""Well you ain't a proper pike angler if you have to revert to using livebaits".................

 

Not only does he obviously know nothing about pike fishing (or at best have a very narrow experience of it) but worse simply has no idea of the wider implications of spouting such rubbish.

 

I hope pike anglers in general will remember his views when they are next considering a purchase....

 

Greetings,

 

Being, as I am, a pleasure angler [Never for pike] I haven't got the least intention of getting seriously involved in the 'live baiting for pike' argument. However, in my humble opinion, I'm not a bad bloke & at the bottom of me I like to think, when push comes to shove, that I'm a christian at heart.

 

Now, getting back to live-baiting. If I had my way I would do the following with THOSE WHO DO apply live baiting techniques.

 

[1] I would suggest that they read the Ten Commandments, "Thou shalt no kill" and all that good stuff, & there's more.

 

[2] I'd take them somewhere such as the 'seriously shark infested' Australian Barrier Reef, get them in a boat, stick one hook [A biggun!] through the gob & the other [Much, much larger!] up the proverbial rigott then I'd toss them over the side!!!! Then, as they were going over, I'd say "See how you like it mate!"

 

Life really makes me wonder at times, it really does. We all reside in a namby-pamby state & we allow people who should know better to use live fish as bait, something wrong there!!

The practice should be banned with immediate effect, and for those who will insist on being 'naugty boy' serious penalties should apply.

 

Regards to you all.

 

DJW