Zander, Your Veiws.

[doc_tench]

phil dean:

Here here, that's my view on Zander, I've caught a few and always released them save where they have been deep hooked due to my ignorance which thankfully alot of reading and this site has hopefully changed. Where I did make the mistake, the fish was quickly dispatched and taken home....and they do taste nice as steve has said.

A pike that is caught by an englishman is quite a lucky pike as he will probably be realeased.

If he is caught by a Frenchman then he will not quite be so lucky as he will probably find himself on the Dinner table.

[Apache]

That is true, although 'tis not just France!

[phil dean]

Don't get me wrong, I'll happily take a pike for the dinner table, where it's good clear water, the pike are fit, healthy and in large numbers, and where the fish is a jack of about 3lb.

 

Oh yes, and I'm going to eat it.

 

At least the french do eat what they catch, what annoys me are those who catch pike and throw them up the bank for no reason...that's just stupid.

[StuMac]

When I was a lad and started pike fishing my Dad told me 'count to 10 then strike'. I've always done that when live / dead baiting, never deep hooked a fish and find it very hard to hook jacks.

 

I lost 2 fish in the 3 - 4 lb catagory on trolled smelts (4 - 5 inches long) on Sunday morning, but managed to land a 5 lb one. That'a about my average hook up rate for small pike. Worse if I use bigger baits like 8 - 9 inch trout. Fish over 8 lb almost invariably hook with no problem no matter what bait I use.

 

When trolling (I hate fishing static baits - find it boring) I leave the rod in the rest with the multipler out of gear but the ratchet on. Although I keep an eye on the float, it's really there to control the depth the bait works at. The first indiction of a bite is *always* the ratchet.

 

When it goes I start counting, switch the outborad off (no problems trolling under power up here) pick the rod up and flip the ratchet off. You can keep the line surprisingly tight without spooking the fish - I just lay my thumb on the spool and let the line run out under just enoughy tension to just put a *slight* bend the rod (at present I use a 7ft Harris light jerkbait rod for this style fishing - excellent length to handle in a boat).

 

During this time I try to get an impresion of which way the fish is swimming. With braid you can feel the fish moving and guage its size, although this is often very misleading as big fish can be very gentle whereas jacks can really tug at the bait.

 

Once I've counted to 10 I tighten into the fish - if it's a jack then I quite often loose it. Often you can reel them to the side of the boat where they spit the bait out. They weren't even hooked jus hanging on by their teeth. If its a decent size fish then the rod bends right over and I almost invariably get a good hook up and land it.

 

If people want to strike straight away - fine, but my method never gives me any problems and I'd recomend it to anyone!

 

 

Peter Waller:

LP, let me put my credentials on the line, if only to underline the fact that I do know something about pike.

 

I caught my first pike when I was nine. My father then sent me out for a day with a good friend of his, a man called Dennis Pye. That is forty eight years ago! I have been catching pike on and off ever since. A good years piking will see over 1000 pike come into, or be unhooked alongside my boat. On five occasions I have had three pike within half an hour to a total weight of over 60 pounds. I first caught over 40 lure caught pike in a session back in 1964. The most I have had in a session, lure fishing is 50, I stopped to go back to work. I have long ago lost count of the twenties that I have caught. As for the thirties, I've yet to exceed the magic 35 pounds, 34.12, but I have had a few. But you get my drift, I do have a little experience of catching pike.

 

Pike can, and do, take a bait with the greatest of finesse. I had a thirty last year that took my lure and I felt absolutely nothing whatsoever. And I have had a number of 20 pound plus fish in similar style. The tension on my line remained EXACTLY the same. The only indication I had of a take was that the line was going off to one side. I struck, and all hell broke loose!

 

My first ever 30 took a plug, the line went slack, I wound down and struck. Nothing, I thought I had hooked the bottom, until it moved off, very gently!

 

Other fish have taken the bait and immediately gone ballistic. One thing is for sure, big pike have survived by being lucky, or by being artful.

 

I never fish more than two rods. Pike need 100% attention. Believe me, not every pike grabs the bait, shakes its head and heads for the horizon.

 

There is one thing about AnglersNet Lurking Pike, there is always someone who knows better! People like Diamond Geezer and Steve Burke for example.

 

You made a sweeping statement that is patently not always true. If you had said, 'in my experience, pike grab the bait etc.' then it might have been better. In my experience pike can be extremely delicate feeders. Pike don't always grab the bait. Sometimes they gently, so gently suck in a dead bait, I've watched them do it! One of the joys of pike is the unpredictability of the wee beasties.

[Lurking Pike]

Well that is a nice story stu.

[corydoras]

Graham X:

 

QUOTE Corydoras: "In my humble opinion the general rule should be 'Thou shalt not suffer a non native and potentially invasive species to live' and if you press me too hard this topic then I will say that yes this should include the all hallowed porcine carp too.

 

I should keep your head WELL down until that one blows over, matey!    

Well they may have been here (carp that is) for a while now, but that does not make them a 'native species', they are still feral.

[waterman1013]

"can anyone back back me up at all"

 

No, sorry LP. I agree absolutely with Peter.

 

I fish for both pike and zander and both can be incredibly finicky feeders. I do not have Peter's wide experience of pike but I have caught zeds to over 10lb and pike to over 20.

 

I just wish the zander bites I get were easier to spot. Most of my time goes into designing rigs which make indication from zeds on the river more certain. I have found that if I am catching zeds then I get no pike and if pike are coming to baits then zeds are absent, so perhaps they do find a niche which they occupy well and exclusively. Certainly, as far as pike are concerned, all my biggest fish have come to single bleaps on the buzzers.

 

For any angling club to expound the destruction of any species of fish puts them firmly in the Victorian period of fisheries management. And they obviously have no understanding of fish populations and the dynamics associated with young/small fish feeding more voraciously than large fish.

 

Enjoy your piking and think about joining the Pike Anglers Club, they have really good publications for beginners and experienced pikers alike. Oh, and zander do make really good eating, nearly as good as bass.

 

Enjoy your fishing

 

Mike

[waterman1013]

StuMac

 

I would agree with you if fishing from a boat but never from the bank or with static deadbaits.

 

Mike

[Newt]

StuMac:

.... If people want to strike straight away - fine, but my method never gives me any problems and I'd recomend it to anyone!

I'll agree IF the folks are fishing from a moving boat and IF they are only using a single rod and IF the rig is such that the fish can clamp down on the bait without having an exposed hook point inside the mouth and near the lip (and IF for some reason they prefer baits to lures).

 

[ 05. June 2003, 09:27 PM: Message edited by: Newt ]

[Peter Waller]

Counting ten then striking, oh dear, it went out with the ark! When do you start counting? When the fish takes the bait, or when you are aware that the bait has been taken? I'm not advocating striking at the first tentative quiver of the float, or bite alarm, but there is no hard and fast rule such as counting ten, which shouldn't cause many problems in itself, or smoking a ciggy as Dick Walker's father is reputed to have said! If the float goes under, if the float rises and stays up, if the float goes off to one side then the fish has the bait in its mouth. What more do you want?

 

Perhaps I am being a tad unfair to the basic idea of counting to ten but I do think there are problems both ways. Some fish just bolt a deadbait, they know its dead. They, as Newt pointed out, sometimes flair their gills and suck the bait in like a vacuum hoover, straight to the back of the throat. Something that has really come to light with the use of slowly worked soft bodied lures. These lures are in a ball right at the back of the pikes mouth, yet by the nature of lure fishing the strike has been instant! I feel certain, and I know a few others hold the same opinion, that some bigger, craftier pike simply pick up a bait, sense something is wrong and eject it, blowing it out long before the angler has got to nine, let alone ten.

 

I have watched, and talked to some top notch pikers, household names, none have counted to ten! All have effectively wound down until they felt the fish and then struck. Simple AND effective. No panic, just cool, calm and collected.

 

Thanks to those of you who have backed me up on this important issue. I hope those to whome my comments have obviously been aimed will take the advice in the spirit in which it is offered.

 

Okay, so confidence comes from experience, sensing that the bait has been positively picked up, then winding down and making contact. Yes, of course you will miss the odd fish, but it is better than damaging them. Counting ten is a starting point, but there is more to it than that.

 

There are pratts out there who rely on their assumed ability to turn a pike's gut inside out so as to release a hook, what an attitude!! :mad:

Don't be one of them.

 

[ 06. June 2003, 12:48 AM: Message edited by: Peter Waller ]